RMIT Professorial Academy

Lecture by Distinguished Professor Elena Ivanova, RMIT Professorial Academy
Topic:  Combating the emerging worldwide epidemic of “super-bugs”
Presented on 3 July 2019 at RMIT University

Transcript

Speaker 1:       My name is Xinghuo Yu, I'm the Chair of the RMIT Professorial Academy. This occasion is around a very important task of this Academy which is about promoting the excellence on research, education and engagement, and also it is about giving advice and engage within the forum. Today it's my good pleasure to introduce Professor Elena Ivanova. She's going to present the fourth RMIT Distinguished Lecture. Just before I introduce her, I'll just give you a bit of introduction of the RMIT Professorial Academy. This Academy was established by the Vice-Chancellor in 2017. The purpose of it is basically trying to make use of the brands and influence of RMIT Distinguished Professors. At this point in time we have 18. I use them as a think tank to advise the University on future strategic directions, sort of a thought leader, and also as an advocator on behalf of the University. The Lectures are one of the important elements of that mission, but we will do more than just that. In the future we also will hold a public forum on issues, on strategies, on policies, which I think you are more than welcome to participate.

Speaker 1:       Today's talk is presented by Distinguished Professor Elena Ivanova. She joined RMIT in 2018. She's from Swinburne and one of the high flyers. Today's talk is about super-bugs. I think this is one of the highest numbers of participants, just because of interest. But I think it's more because of interest of topic and also, I guess, people want to know you more, about what you're going to do for us.

Speaker 1:       She's going to talk about her research and also her perspective. More than just her own research and perspective, about the future. What do we see for the future. Certainly, we all worry about super-bugs, so you know, that's why we're all very interested in what it is you have to say.

Speaker 1:       Please give a round of applause to welcome Professor Ivanova.

Speaker 2:       Thank you very much for the nice introduction.

Speaker 2:       I'm very honoured to talk to you today about our work and, as you see now, it's one of the major concerns worldwide, the epidemic of super-bugs. And they tell you that we are not losing the battle. There is a light at the end of the tunnel and we will see how we can do it.

Speaker 2:       As an introduction, I would like to talk about some problems imposed by antibiotic resistance, bacterial infections and emerging super-bugs. And then we can see how insect wings, natural bactericidal surfaces could be a potential solution to some of these problems. And I'll show you examples of novel mechanical ways, how we can kill bacteria without any need of antibiotics.

Speaker 2:       The rise of super-bugs. I'm sure you're all well-aware of increasing numbers of reports telling us really dramatic stories. Just a few of them are on the screen. In 2017 the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported that a woman in Nevada died from an infection resistant to all available antibiotics in the United States. In the same year, there was another report in China when super-bug Escherichia coli in this case was found resistant to last resort antibiotics carbapenems. That is an antibiotic of broad spectrum of beta-lactam plus. In fact, in Victoria 2016, a 56-year old man from rural Victoria with no history of hospital contact or international travel was reported to have died from Klebsiella pneumoniae and that particular strain was resistant to all antibiotics available in Australia.

Speaker 2:       Just to tell you that the background of this slide, what you see here, is an electron micrograph of Staphylococcus aureus or 'Golden Staph,' which is resistant to Methicillin and you can see how it is colonising, how it can colonise some blood cells. It's growing and colonising the cells.

Speaker 2:       Now, before we go on any further, I thought it will be useful to give you some terminology so that we all know what actually is a super-bug. A definition I found in The Royal Institution of Australia 2017, a 'super-bug' is usually defined as "a microorganism that is resistant to commonly used antibiotics" and of course 'antibiotic resistance', if you look at a major website, you'll find a definition of ‘antibiotic resistance’ which is "an ability of microorganisms and that could be bacteria, fungi or protozoans to grow despite exposure to antimicrobial substances designed to inhibit their growth."

Speaker 2:       You may ask me, how we now come to this point where the antimicrobial resistance is developed. There are several different ways. The major reason is selective pressure through drug use in medicine. Another serious reason is that uncontrollable use of antibiotics in many countries. Australia is not there, not in that list. Also, inappropriate prescriptions. But the major misuse is in agriculture. It's up to 70% of all antibiotics produced worldwide actually used mostly as a prophylactic against disease or as a growth promoter. And, of course, we do not forget about genetic transformation where the genes developed resistance to antibiotics could be easily transferred among different groups of bacteria.

Speaker 2:       Again, you may ask me, is it so difficult to kill bacteria still? It's so small. Well, look at these facts. Temperature: high temperature can destroy proteins, nucleic acids and damage membrane, yet we have bacteria called Pyrolobus fumarii, which can grow at temperatures up to 113 degrees. How about radiation? Can radiation kill bacteria? Yes, it can, but not all of them. There is a bacterium called Deinococcus radiodurans, which can withstand ionizing radiation up to 20 kGy and also UV exposure. What about pressure? There are actually obligatory piezophilic species that can grow at 70 to 80 Mpa. What about reactive oxygen species? In fact, oxidative damage induces production of antioxidants and detoxifying enzymes by bacteria, so they can easily develop resistance to any reactive oxygen species.

Speaker 2:       Now, you can ask me again, why are they so smart? Why are the bugs so smart? And I'm always telling that don't forget that bacteria are the oldest life form on our planet. They have survived an evolution of 3.8 billion years and of course and they've developed versatile metabolic pathways. They can colonise each and every surface. They can survive everywhere, everywhere. Now look at this example. It was estimated that the total number of bacteria in 70 kg (so called ‘Reference Man’), could be 38 trillion. 38 trillion. It could be roughly up to 5 kgs we have in our body. And look at this scanning electron micrograph which I used as the background of this slide. What you see here is a community of bacteria which are found on the surface of our tongue. So, bacteria everywhere and looks like it's not that easy to kill them.

Speaker 2:       Now how do they survive? You may ask me again. A single bacterial cell will not be able to survive because it's very tiny, it's not protected, it’s very difficult for it to survive. What happens, bacteria survives in communities. And these communities are called biofilms. What you see here is just a single bacteria cell, they call it free-floating planktonic cells, settled on the surface. They aggregate, form micro-colonies and excrete extracellular polymeric material. That's how the biofilm is formed. The biofilm growing through that and producing a complex, three-dimensional structure. Something like that, what you see here. And cells they are protected by extracellular polymeric material against host immune cells and antibiotics. When the biofilm reaches a critical mass, the cells could release planktonic cells, could release again and colonise each and every other available surface. That's how the bacteria spread. Once, it forms a biofilm and release from the biofilm.

Speaker 2:       And this is also a reason why they can easily develop resistance to antibiotics because in the biofilm, they are protected from any antibacterial treatments. In fact, and they form infections. Implant-associated infections is number one cause of implant failure in patients. What is also dangerous is once the biofilm reaches the bloodstream, the bacteria can colonise more surfaces in our body. On this little picture, you see size of primary and secondary infections. And in a way that was our own motivation. We wanted to design surfaces which would be free from bacteria. We wanted to fabricate surfaces which could be used for bacterial implants. What you see here is a little movie made in our lab, maybe a good ten years ago now, showing how quickly Golden Staph can colonise the surface of titanium, which is commonly used in implantable materials for the hip replacement you will see here. And here is the real scanning electron micrograph of the biofilm form Staphylococcus pseudointermedius on the orthopaedic bone screw. That's what is happening.

Speaker 2:       Now, as I say, our motivation was to design these surfaces, but how did we rationalise our motivation. We were thinking that, because bacteria survived through colonisation on surfaces, why don't we look at the surface typography and see if we can modify the typography of the surface and stop bacteria from attaching. Once we stop bacteria from attaching on the surface, the biofilm will not be formed and we will be safe. So typography was our focus and the very first experiment we've done, but before we go there, I'll tell you currently what a traditional approach is, where people try to design antibacterial surfaces.

Speaker 2:       Of course, we are not the only one group trying to design antibacterial surfaces. Currently there are basically two major classes of antibacterial surfaces. Antibiofouling, which will be repelling bacterial cells from the surface, and bactericidal. In this type of surface, the bacteria in contact with the surface will be killed effectively. For that, we use a low molecular weight antibacterial compound including antibiotics, it could be antimicrobial peptides or even silver. Unfortunately, there are some drawbacks associated with these approaches. Toxicity, non-uniformity coatings, decrease in efficacy, environmental health concern and, of course, microbial resistance to antibacterial agents. So back to the start of our work, what was now many years ago, the attachment points or settling points theory was one of the main well accepted norms. What it says is that "the organisms smaller than the scale of the surface micro-texture will attach in larger numbers in micron scale shelters on the textured surface and will have greater adhesion strength because of the multiple attachment points on the surface". So, we said, all right, how about very small surface without many, no attachment point. Would it repel bacterial cells?

Speaker 2:       And the very first, very simple experiment was done by one of our PhD students. Just using the standard microscopic slide, which is actually quite smooth, with the average surface roughness in the range of 2 nanometres, and after the treatment with the buffered solution of hydrofluoric acid, these little peaks are gone and you see this surface even more smooth, with 1.3 nanometre roughness. What you can see here, is just a remarkable response of bacterial cells where you see that the film numbers on the nano-smooth surface, which is really not much change, is even increased. Also changed morphology, morphological transformations and extracellular polymeric substances. So, we re-confirmed this result using different surfaces, including titanium and also using different range of surface roughness, and the results were the same.

Speaker 2:       The main conclusion coming from this work is that the bacteria is far more susceptible to nanometre scale roughness than previously believed and nano-smooth surfaces do not represent a repelling environment for bacterial attachment. So that's why we had to move on and find any other surfaces which may be free from bacteria. And of course, we always look at nature. In nature, what you see in nature, there are lots of examples of bacteria-free surfaces and these are plants or insects, where you can find them free from bacteria. Now, the particular self-cleaning effect associated with these types of surfaces and it's mostly due to the superhydrophobicity of these surfaces, which in turn is a combination of surface chemistry and a particular amount of typography. So, these superhydrophobic surfaces, in a way, are not wet. And the water droplets just bounce on the surfaces and slide, roll off. And on the way of rolling off, it takes all contaminants away from the surface, so it's remaining clean.

Speaker 2:       What we've done next, in collaboration with our colleagues in a Laser Center at Hannover University, we were able to mimic the surface of lotus leaf on titanium and that's how it looks like on your left-hand side. You see an example of what that droplet's behaviour on the glass surface and on the superhydrophobic surface. Obviously, the water contact angle is 153 degrees. Now what happens when we immerse this surface in suspension with bacterial cells? And for that, we used two different types of cells: P. aeruginosa and S. aureus. You see, P. aeruginosa didn't really attach on this surface. However, S. aureus quite successfully colonised this type of the surface. We have to answer the question of why?

Speaker 2:       And it was the brilliant work of our PhD student, Dr Truong, now also a staff member of School of Science. We looked at what happened to surface when they immersed in water. What you see here is a little movie showing you how quickly air replaced by water. So, and that is really followed by the aggregation of S. aureas cells and their colonisation of the surface. Basically, air was one of the most important components in this surface and this surface lost air and it became favourable for attachment or S. aureus cells in particular. So that was quite a disappointing result. So, we looked at other examples of bacteria-free surfaces in nature and there are insects.

Speaker 2:       The next object for our work was actually cicadas. You all know that cicadas are the loudest insect in the world and there are numerous species in the range of 200 species are available in Australia. We used in our work one particular species called Psaltoda claripennis. If you look at the nanoscale, the wing of the cicada will be composed of a tiny, tiny nanopillars of just only 200 nanometres tall and 60 nanometres in diameter. It's a very, very fine pattern which forms in the epi cuticle of insects. What you see here is really the wettability map constructed by another PhD student, showing that the surface maintains high superhydrophobic features with the water conduct angle ranges from 163-173 degrees. What happened with the bacterial cells when we immersed the membrane of the insect wing in the suspension with bacterial cells? And as you can see, we didn't get the results which we expected. We saw that bacterial cells will not be able to attach on this surface. They will be repelled, similar to the water droplet. But what you see here, it was quite the opposite: bacterial cells happily attached on this surface but it looks like they are not so happy. So what you see here is a collage of scanning the electron micrographs, [inaudible 00:20:52] there's also [inaudible 00:20:54] and confocal imaging indicating that the cells are actually dead on the surface.

Speaker 2:       Another experiment is an atomic force experiment. What we showed is that the bactericidal efficiency of the killing process of the cell on the surface of the wing is remarkably fast in the range of 200 seconds, we detect a rupturing point and it was quite a nice match with the height of the nanopillars, which was 200 nanometres. Basically, one single cell could be ruptured in 200 seconds by, I'm talking about Pseudomonas aeruginosa cell, a particular type of the cell. The efficiency, the killing efficiency is also quite good. What you see here is that the number of viable cells remaining in suspension was decreased by 96% per square centimetre over 30 minutes. So that was quite, we were quite happy with the results.

Speaker 2:       Now the question then, again, was how did this happen? Was it a chemistry playing a role in this activity or not? In order to eliminate the fact or understand whether or not chemistry has any effect, we spattered gold on the surface of the wing. And it's a very thin layer of just 10 nanometres gold so that the pattern is not changed so we wanted to maintain the pattern, the same type of the pattern. And what you see here is that in fact, the bactericidal effect remained the same. A conclusion for this work was that the surface chemistry is not really important in the bactericidal effect on the cicada wing, but rather it is typography that is the dominant factor.

Speaker 2:       Another question is to ask, how is it happening? What is the killing process? What is involved in this killing process? The theoretical analysis was done in collaboration with a group of physicists in Spain in University of Rovira i Virgili. That was a PhD student Sergey Pogodin at that time. He modelled the membrane of bacterial cell as elastic layer because the thickness of the membrane in the range of 6, maximum 10 nanometres and the diameter is quite large compared to this one. And what really happens in this particular situation. The bacterial cell is suspended on the array of the nanopillars and the stress which is developed upon this suspension such as high that it breaks, but it breaks, rupturing in between the nanopillars. So in a way these pillars cannot pierce the cell. And this is a very common mistake with some of the people trying to understand what happened on the surface. It's all about dimension. So the large, like this 6 nanometre pillar, it cannot really pierce a really thin layer of the membrane. Rather it stretches and breaks in between the pillars.

Speaker 2:       Unfortunately, this particular type of the nanopattern is only active against Gram-negative bacterial cells. Gram- positive cells, and we tested quite a few of them, Gram-positive bacterial cells remain safe on this type of the nanopattern. The reason for that, we believe that, our hypothesis, we didn't prove it yet, in the different thickness of the Peptidoglycan layer, which adds full Gram-positive bacterial cells additionally GDT for the film, so it's much harder to rupture it. So that's our working hypothesis. Hopefully, we'll try to prove it.

Speaker 2:       Now, the next object in our work was dragonflies. Dragonflies are another numerous group of insects and if you look at the pattern of this insect, it's quite different, that is the pattern of the dragonfly. Maybe it's not that clear here but it's pretty much clear here. It’s very random array of different lengths, quite some different lengths of the nanopillars. Very difficult to describe it. But what is interesting here, this type of the nanopattern is very active. Basically, it ruptured all cell types including B. subtilis spores. This is quite a remarkable observation, though we wanted also to understand, if different types or different species of dragonflies have exactly the same pattern, but looks like they're not, and whether or not they're the same. Well, what is exactly the same, it may be visual similarity. If you look at the surfaces of the dragonfly wings they look quite similar. But yet, they are not identical. On this little movie, you see the behaviour of the water bouncing, taken by a high speed CD camera which takes 28,000 frames per second. So that's what you see here, that's how the water droplets films when it bounces off the surface of the dragonfly wing.

Speaker 2:       On this table, you see the comparison of the nanopillar height and density for this type of species. It's quite similar, quite similar. But when we used three different species of dragonfly and looked at the bactericidal activity, it appears to be different. So that's what you see on this slide that the one Diplacodes bipunctata is the most active one and the two others, which we used, are quite different. AFM topology analysis showed that in fact the curvature, the geometry of the pillars maybe the key when the slight variation in the nanopattern may severely affect the bactericidal performance of the nanopatterns.

Speaker 2:       Our next work on trying to understand using simplified forces which are involved in the killing bacterial cells. And this work was about the simplified model of the cell membrane which is really the Giant Unilamellar Vesicles or GUVs, which were constructed from DOPC and we used two other species, other different species of dragonfly.

Speaker 2:       So, on this image you see the Cryo-SEM image of the GUV which was done for the first time, for some reason, despite that this is a very common model of liposome contraction, from variable defined lipids. We couldn't see that before in Cryo-SEM analysis. So, what we'd done at that time was understanding whether or not these GUVs would be ruptured on the surfaces of both species of dragonfly. And, in fact, they both ruptured on this type of the surfaces.

Speaker 2:       What you see here is a confocal scanning of micrographs and cryo-scanning electron micrographs, showing different stages of rupturing, GUVs rupturing on the surfaces of the wing. And that allowed us to estimate that the minimum about of additional tension required to mechanically rupture the GUVs was in the range of 4.3-6.75 mN per metre, but that's all dependent on the relative size of the GUV. That was a pretty good match with the previously recorded data, I think using a micropipette asperation, so we were pretty happy with that, but that's not a direct estimation of the forces. It's still something to study further, so that's a load of work to be done.

Speaker 2:       Now natural bactericidal surfaces are very good and very interesting but the question is, can we fabricate this in synthetic analogue. And the answer is, yes, we can. What you see here is an example of first biomimetic analogue of natural bactericidal surface, or Black Silicon. In fact, it's quite easy, the fabrication of this type of surface is quite easy. It's a matter of optimization of the parameters. So, I'm not going into technical details of the fabrication, just only tell you that its basically plasma assisted reactive ion etching, a quite common technique. Once again, it’s a matter of recipe and optimization of the recipe and you can quite reliably and consistently get the same pattern of your choice.

Speaker 2:       Now on this slide, what you see is a similarity of the pattern which we found on the dragonfly wing and Black Silicon. Once again what you see here, it's quite similar, but it's not an identical pattern. And in a way, it's a good thing. Which means that the pattern which will be bactericidal may not be necessarily identical to the previously found or designed or fabricated. It could be different but of course the variation may be in a very narrow range of the nanofeatures. So that's what you see here, that's a dragonfly and this is a Black Silicon pattern. The table gives you an overview of the bactericidal surfaces which could be of different stability. Black Silicon is not super hydrophobic. The chemical composition could be different, the nanoprotusions or nanofeatures of this surface could be also different, bactericidal effectiveness could be also variable, depending on the pattern. However, what you see here that sometimes synthetic analogue of natural bactericidal surface may achieve a greater performance as a natural template of bactericidal surfaces. So, it’s all about optimization of the surface nanoscale parameters.

Speaker 2:       The mechanism in the context of the dragonfly is not really defined as yet. We believe this is our hypothesis. It's still stretching of the membrane when it's ruptured in between the nanopillars because even the Black Silicon nanopillars appear to be sharper. They're not reaching the dimensions below 10 nanometres. So basically, it's really from a very theoretical point of view, it's very difficult to pierce the cell. Still the membrane will be hard to pierce.

Speaker 2:       What is another remarkable thing about this type of the surfaces, in the way they are self-cleaning? But they are not self-cleaning as it was in the context of the water, when it's bouncing off the surface, but it is self-cleaning when you see that the cell debris actually removing from the surface all the time. The removal of the cell debris from the surface is not as quick as it's rupturing and it's highly dependent on the nanopattern. But in a range, it could be 20-30 minutes, which is required to remove the dead cells from the surface where the debris is probably floating around in the environment.

Speaker 2:       Now you may ask how about eukaryotic cells, what happened in eukaryotic cells? If bacterial cells are effectively ruptured, what about big, large cells? As you can see here, that was our work some time ago where we used fibroblast-like cells, what you see here it's a movie of attachment and settling of COS-7 cell on the Black Silicon surface. And here you see a freeze fracture image where you see the cell and the nanopattern. So, the cell is safe on the nanoscale pattern. Well, if you think from the logical point of view, the nanopillars are too small and I'm always saying that, perhaps it's like a mosquito bite for us, that's what the nanopattern for eukaryotic cell. It’s a matter of different scales of the pattern, which may affect. So for eukaryotic cell bactericidal surfaces are safe. And in a way, it has a very significant, and it’s very important in the context of implantable biomaterials.

Speaker 2:       What you see here, it's another experiment. When we try here to infect the surfaces with infectious doses of pathogenic bacteria, and after that seed the surfaces with eukaryotic cells. As you see here within six hours, bacterial cells are effectively ruptured and eukaryotic cells you can see on the next slide are growing very nicely. So what you see here is the COS-7 cells on Black Silicon pre-infected with Pseudomonas aeruginosa and the same green surface pre-infected with S. aureus. And you see on Day 7, eukaryotic cells are growing nicely and reaching confluence stage and on the surfaces, which are flat or the ones which are used for implants, the infected surfaces keep going with the bacterial cells. I mean bacteria pathogen, bacteria happily growing on these surfaces and they, in fact, inhibit and contaminate eukaryotic cells. And eukaryotic cells do not survive on these surfaces.

Speaker 2:       Moving on, the effect of mechano-bactericidal surfaces, as we are trying to now develop this further to show you that it's quite versatile. So there are different ways which we can use or we can use a different type of nanopattern to kill bacterial cell by different way. This is another example when we can cut bacterial cell through using the nanostructured surface. And this surface could be a graphene-like surfaces. What you see here, that you can have a graphene surface with graphene flakes, which is very easy to obtain and we looked at different types of flakes fabricated from graphene and see how bacterial cells will respond on this. On the top you see graphite surfaces. And these two types of graphene surfaces, they are, in fact, highly bactericidal.

Speaker 2:       But until now, the nature of bactericidal activity of graphene flakes is not really resolved. Well there are two hypotheses. One hypothesis says that extraction of the bactericidal effect on graphene flakes. Extraction of the lipids from the membrane, that's what they say what happened when the cell interacts with graphene flakes. What we think it is and that is our work where we are trying to prove it, that actually it is a pore formed due to reorientation of lipid cells to graphene surface while they are interacting with the graphene flakes. What you see here, it's a little bit enlarged images confocal images showing the red cells, which I killed, looking swollen. And that's apparently because the cell, when its cut through, the environment external liquid comes inside and it appeared swollen.

Speaker 2:       Now the theoretical analysis done in collaboration with the same theoretical physicist group in University of Rovira i Virgili, that is Vladimir Baulin you see here, and they apply single chainmail field simulation to show that the pores are actually formed in the interaction. We believe this type of bactericidal activity, the bactericidal efficiency on graphene-like substrata or graphene-like material of this kind depends on the lateral size, shape and interactive angle of exposed sharp edges which are likely to puncture the bacterial cell membrane.

Speaker 2:       Another way we can kill bacterial cells using nanostructure surfaces is this. I'll show you how bacterial cells are torn apart on the nanostructure surfaces. What you see here is exceptionally high aspect ratio up to 3000 of vertically aligned carbon nanotubes. This work was done in collaboration with the group of Michael de Volder in Cambridge University. So what they've done, they grew carbon nanotubes from a catalyst layer and deposited on a silicon wafer using physical vapor deposition. We used two types of the pattern with the one microgram and 30 microgram vertically aligned carbon nanotubes. What you see here is that this type of the surface is also quite bactericidal. The highest bactericidal rates of 99.3% for P. aeruginosa and 84.9% for S. aureus were recorded on one microgram tall vertically aligned carbon nanotubes.

Speaker 2:       Now the question is, again, how this happened? Why? And this is quite interesting. In collaboration with the same group, what we found and they applied so-called engineer's beam theory, or linear theory of elasticity. This same theory was applied for engineering of the Eiffel Tower and this large wheel. It's exactly the same theory used for construction and we applied it to explain the high aspect ratio. So what you see here and what is explained is just stored and released energy. So basically the bending of very tall nanofeatures, when bending they store energy. And when they bend back, they release energy. And that's how it tears the cell apart. And it's quite logical to imagine that, of course, one microgram nanotubes are actually more rigid and store higher energy and that's why they are more effective.

Speaker 2:       And I think, I just would like to finish up with some aspects of the nanofabrication which is currently in this field and give you just one example of our recent work on the hydrothermal treatment of titanium. So basically there are different types of nanofabrication techniques which could be applied to produce nanopatterns. And the nanopatterns could be quite different. It still will be active but the range of the activity could be quite different, so that is a change. These are techniques you can use: laser irradiation, lithography, plasma etching, electrospinning, and even simple data of nanoimplant lithography template methods. It's all about the resolution, but with advances in nanofabrication where we can reach nanoscale resolutions, then the results will always be promising.

Speaker 2:       The hydrothermal treatment is one of the examples of nanofabrication using a very simple technique, but again, it's a matter of optimization. Optimization of parameters and time of the treatment where you can fabricate the surface of different patterns. So what you see here is the formation of asymmetrical nanosheets with sharp nanoedges and in a way, I would say the mechanism of bactericidal efficiency here could be similar to the sharp edge of graphene nanoflakes. It's in the same type of bactericidal effect as we believe it is. If you look at the bactericidal activity you see the P. aeruginosa could be up 100% cells killed and a quite large range of the treatment conditions, however S. aureus is much more difficult to kill, as all this. But it could be a high rate of killing could be achieved after six hours treatment of these surfaces.

Speaker 2:       And I would like to finish up again with this particular antibiotic resistance problem and show you if nanostructured surfaces, and we call them mechano-bactericidal surfaces, can kill antibiotic resistant strains. What you see here, I just wanted to emphasize that we used and there is a report from the Centers for Disease Control in the United States, 2013. And this year, in autumn they will break news in new edition of the same report. They identify the top 18 antibiotic resistance threats in the United States and Methicillin-resistant S. aureus is one of those threats regarded as a "Serious Threat". What I also found quite upsetting data that in the way there was epidemics that in our community, it's up to 5% of healthcare workers in the United States are carrying this Methicillin-resistant Staph aureus. And up to 2% of the population are actually carrying the same thing.

Speaker 2:       Now I probably wouldn't stop here except just to tell you that the antibiotic resistance and mechanisms are quite different, for different types of antibiotics in the case of Methicillin-resistant bacteria. What happens with this strain. First of all, the drug cuts the bonding, the close-linking that is again Peptidoglycan. So once the drug cuts this close link between the Peptidoglycan layer, the inner work is damaged and the cell is dead. What is happening in the Methicillin-resistant strain? It is actually building the bonding again and that's how it survives. That's how the resistance is developed. And now what we did in this work, we used Methicillin-resistant strain and Methicillin-susceptible strain (our regional standard strain) and we put this strain on the hydrotreated titanium surfaces and what you see here, they are dead. They are dead. It doesn't matter in the presence of antibiotics, I should say, the build up of the reconstruction of the bonding of the peptidoglycan layer triggers by the presence of antibiotics. That's why we run experiments in standard physiological conditions and in the presence of antibiotics. And you can see both types of the strains are successfully killed by the surface.

Speaker 2:       So, yes the conclusion we arrived to that highly bactericidal nanotopologies of insect wings represent the first reported example of purely physical antibacterial activity and opened a new era of biomedical antimicrobial nanotechnology. These mechano-bactericidal surfaces will be potentially useful when applied to implants reducing the risks for post-operative bacterial infection, and minimizing the demand for antibiotics, thereby helping to combat antibiotic resistance. Mechano-bactericidal can, of course, be exploited in various industrial and bionic applications.

Speaker 2:       Future directions. The target now is to fabricate the surface with dual-functionality so there will be repelled bacterial cells and the ones that will not be able to repel and settle on the surface will be killed by this surface. This is our next goal and hopefully we can achieve it with the help of a group of students.

Speaker 2:       And I think that was all from me. I would like to acknowledge many, many people without the excellent contribution of these people, this work wouldn't be finished, confirmed, performed. And of course, Professor Russell Crawford, Khanh, lots of people from Swinburne University of Technology and our colleagues all over the world, and this last slide with the students. Oh! with the students, and I was hoping that the movie would run, showing the work of the students on the left, but it looks like it's not. But thank you very much for your kind attention.

Speaker 1:       Thank you very much for a very interesting and entertaining talk. Any questions? We can have a few minutes for a few questions. Yes.

Speaker 2:       Did I go too long?

Speaker 1:       It's all right.

Questions and Answers

Speaker 3:       So beautiful and eye-opening. So one potential problem, one potential opportunity in terms of [inaudible 00:49:21] or targeting all the type of lipid-enveloped organisms. So Pox viruses, the largest viruses, around 500 nanometers and they're lipid-enveloped. So I was just wondering as you were talking if there might be some utility also in that area? And the problem, the eukaryotic cells at least you've shown you've tested in this presentation, they have very nice mechanisms for recycling their membrane, for keeping membrane stability. But red cells, we have a red cell expert sitting there at the front, do not have those same capacities. So how would you see first in the opportunity in the Pox viruses and perhaps the in vivo utility in terms of perhaps negatively affecting red cells?

Speaker 2:       That's a very good question. I'm impressed you know this, the possible effect on the red blood cells. You are absolutely right: red blood cells are very specific and they will not be safe on the pattern and we actually did this work and we showed that they are not safe. But again, what I want to emphasize all over again, it's a matter of the pattern. So, you can optimize the structure, the nanofeatures of the pattern and use the pattern which will be bactericidal to bacterial cells, say even the super high aspect ratio features which kills a bacterial cell by a different way. But by this way the eukaryotic cells will remain safe again, including red blood cells. We simply didn't test it. But that will be beautiful work, actually to compare different types of bactericidal patterns and see how they affect red blood cells. But I think that not all patterns will be similarly affecting red blood cells.

Speaker 2:       As for the viruses, it’s a matter of, again, the nanopattern and the fabrication. I remember when we just started working on this, the resolution of the nanopattern seven years ago, was so poor that we couldn't even dream about what we can do now. So, for the viruses you need a pattern with more fine features, nanofeatures to see. But I can't guarantee. So there needs to be some work done.

Speaker 1:       Thank you very much.

Speaker 4:       It's been such a fantastic presentation and beautiful work. I'm also wanting to follow on from Magdalena's question about how you think this technology might work inside the gastrointestinal tract to, you know, engineer the microbial population. So really targeting and dealing with that mucus and biofilm, and that sort of environment.

Speaker 2:       I don't have any answers on this question because no work was done. I don't know. There's no perfect solution, because that's the nature of science. As long as we go on our way, we find something else. So, so far, I don't know the answer. But I'm sure that we can handle in the future and find a solution.

Speaker 4:       And we can discuss together.

Speaker 1:       [inaudible 00:53:00]

Speaker 5:       Can you put the surfaces on the cactus?

Speaker 2:       Yes. It could be... like I said, maybe five, seven years ago, it was basically impossible to put this particular nanoscale resolution in the range of 10-100 nanometres on the plastic. Now it is possible. I can tell you that there is a company in Japan, they are very close to fabricating that type of a nanopattern in a large commercially up-scaling area. So yes, it is coming.

Speaker 1:       Any more questions? It's okay, we have another second, it's fine.

Speaker 6:       I went to a beautiful talk recently [inaudible 00:54:01] where she was describing on the smaller scale how polymers by their nature and flexibility could avoid the binding of proteins and how their movement and their typography was very, very important. As you were talking I was wondering, because you were saying there was the issue of attachment and then there is the issue of the clearance. And I was wondering when you were presenting your talk, all the surfaces you were showing us were rigid. And whether there were any plans of also exploring motility.

Speaker 2:       Yes. And it is work also about to be completed. Like I said before, it was very difficult to run a systematic study with changing only one parameter on the surface like the length of the nanofeatures. It was only possible to achieve using nanotypography which is very expensive and very, kind of, difficult to achieve. We still managed to have this particular type of the samples and about to finalise this work where indeed the bending could be a part of the effect. Yeah.

Speaker 1:       All right. I think we might just stop here. We’ve got refreshments next door. So you can continue to talk to Elena and mingle with each other. So thank you very much for coming and hopefully we'll see you next time in September for another one. So thank you very, very much.

Speaker 2:       Thank you. Thank you.    

Xinghuo Yu:My name is Xinghuo Yu, I'm the chair of RMIT Professorial Academy. I'm chairing this distinguished lecture as well. This is just the one, the Academy was established in 2019, consisting of 20 RMIT distinguished professors who are the prominent researchers, and academic in the university. The role of us is certainly there's three roles, we act like a think tank advising university on the strategies, we promote universities and also we represent universities, so today is the ... Lastly, we have two distinguished lectures and this is the first in 2018, so we're very glad to have distinguished professor Mike Xie, to give us a talk. So, this is going to be a very interesting, when Mike sent email to me say, “Hey, here's the talk I'm going to say.” And I looked at I say, “Can you make it as simple as possible? Because we have a very different, wide range of ... People have different knowledge.” So, he made it, so I think the title is great. Make something beautiful, we note when something is beautiful, is expensive as well, but he's also trying to make it efficient.

Xinghuo Yu:So, I just have a very quick introduction of Mike. Mike is Distinguished Professor in RMIT, he's very well known around the world. If you look at his CV, he received a number of very significant awards, for example, the 2017 Clunies Ross Innovation Award from Australia Academy of Technological Science and Engineering. He also was recipient of 2017 Michelle medal by Engineer Australian for his work in mechanical engineering, which surprising is ... I was surprised you're civil engineer, right? But now he got a mechanical engineer award.

Xinghuo Yu:And he's done many work more than, I think one of the things I found Mike is actually a great example, also translation from research to industry application, and vice versa, which he has done very well. So, I think without any delay, let's welcome Mike to deliver his lecture.

Mike Xie:Thank you Xinghou for your introduction, and thank you all for coming all the way to this lecture. It's a great honor to present the first distinguished lecture of RMIT University. I grew up in a small town in Jianzhu Tanzhou. This is what it looks like where I grew up. This is a grand canal connecting all the way from Beijing to Hangzhou. At that time, I wasn't appreciating how lucky I was to live in such a beautiful environment. My parents always ask us to study hard, to go to big cities, to look for opportunities, which I did. The first city I went was Shanghai. This is a photo of Shanghai, and you'll see this kind of buildings, Myers and Myers. And then, I went to London in Britain to study, come to Sydney. My first job was in University Sydney. On the left hand side you'll see ... Some of you may recognize this building. To me, it's the ugliest building in Sydney, this is the UTS building on Broadway when I walked home every night, I would see this building.

Mike Xie:And then, I came to Melbourne. I was living in Footscray, and I'd drive to work. I would see these two buildings in [race coast view 00:04:08] I think some of you know these buildings. So, these are the kind of buildings we see in big cities, and after 40, 50 years ... Nowadays when I go home, I really appreciate how lucky I was. And on the other side, when China become rich and we are doing something different so, because of the wealth generated and the exuberance or this rational exuberance, we are creating [monsters buildings 00:04:45] like this, and in the newspaper we were actually imposing how much steel we used to construct this world record stadium, and there's other buildings created. So, on the left is a CCTV Tower of China, on the right hand side it's the headquarter of People's Daily, and so, it resembles some human organs rather than [inaudible 00:05:19] the buildings.

Mike Xie:So, what I'm going to share with you today is how we can ... Because as engineers we always ask us questions like how we can create some beautiful structures, and also it's efficient. So, not only can we save the materials, we can also create something interesting and beautiful.

Mike Xie:And one of the contributions I made to this field, I'm an Engineer, but I have many friends in architecture. So, we come up with a very simple idea, say, if you want to design a better structure, you can actually start from any silly design, and look at what you have got currently and remove those unneeded parts. Those most inefficient parts you can gradually remove from your design, and then gradually you will end up with a structure, that structure is not only efficient, it looks very beautiful just like what you see in nature, I'll show you some examples soon. The advantages of our simple idea, it's so easy to understand. I'm sure when I show you examples you will see why we are getting this kind of shapes. And also it can be implemented very easily. When people read our papers they can spend a few hours then they can do exactly what we do on the computers.

Mike Xie:So, I'll show you the first example, say, if we want to design a structure for these given conditions, there's one point fixed, I apply gravity, I want to know what would be the best shape to satisfy these given conditions. If we don't know the answer, it can not matter, we can just start from this square shape, and then we can do a simple analysis of the structure. We would find the stress distribution of the structure, fix here apply gravity, and these purple areas, they have no stress. It indicates these corners, they're not useful from the structure point of view. If you remove these parts, it would not affect your structure performance. If they are not useful, why would you keep them.

Mike Xie:So, you can delete all these inefficient materials step by step, and you come up with something more efficient, and it's interesting, looks like apple. It can continue to evolve, and you get a small tiny cherry. It's just a coincidence, and when I published this work, a professor in Cambridge, he said, “Ah, I can do better.” Because I only use one material in my model, so he started to put a different material in the core and by changing the relative stiffness, he got a series of pairs and many other things.

Mike Xie:We are not just getting some beautiful pictures, but if we compare the two designs on the left, you can see different colors throughout the whole structure. On the right hand side, we see the same color on the surface. So, we got a design, which has uniform surface stress. Because this is the criteria we use, if you have low stress we delete it. And if you use different rules to satisfy different design objective, you will get different shapes. Because the idea is so simple, it has been utilized by many engineers, and architects, material scientists for many different applications. So, you can design a building by controlling the drift of a building, the top of the building or it can change the vibration frequency for buildings and the earthquake or wind We also did a project with Boeing several years ago for maximizing the buckling load of composite aircraft wing. And we are lucky to have another Boeing student in the audience. James is working with us, extending this work to the aircraft design.

Mike Xie:So, I'm going to show you some of the examples we have done. So, when you design a structure, it really depends on what material you use, you will get totally different shape. Some of you might have seen the stair cable bridges. These cables that are good for attention, the cables cannot sustain any compression. So, if your material is suitable for attention then, your final structure should be predominantly intention. I show you one example, you'll understand how it goes, because your final structure needs to be intentioned. You can start again from any silly design, and then every time, every step you remove the areas with the highest compressive stress, and you will end up with a material only intention.

Mike Xie:So, this is a very simple example, so, I fix two points and I apply the gravity, and I want to find a shape which would be suitable for a stay cable or some membrane structures. So, every time I remove the areas with highest compressive stress, then I will get a catenary shape. So, when you hold a metal chain, that shape is a catenary and you would only have tension throughout whole structure. Not only have I got a shape for the structure, it also indicates where you need more materials so, on the two sides, because it's supporting half of the weight of the structure, you have more materials here then at the bottom, here the forces are very small so, the relative size is also small.

Mike Xie:If you see around us, most of our structures are made of concrete, the concrete is good for compression. So, if you want to design a structure for bricks, masonry stones, and you want your structure to be in compression, and again you can start from any design and then, every time you remove the areas with the highest tension stress so remove all the areas in tension, you will left with a structure, which will be in compression. And when I was doing this work about 10 or 12 years ago, I was very lucky that I have a colleague, Professor Mark Burry, some of us know him. He's a very well known architect, he's a Chief Executive Architect for this famous building in Barcelona. So, at that time Mark was working on this Passion Façade, and these columns on this Facade.

Mike Xie:There were very few joints left behind by the original architect Gaudi. Gaudi started designing this structure about a hundred years ago. At that time he was using this physical models with chains and weights. If you look at this structure, every point on the chain is in tension, and what Gaudi did, he put this model upside down then everywhere would be in compression. Because he was building this church using stone, which is similar to concrete. It needs to be in compression to be efficient. So, if you turn this model upside down, you will get a shape, which would be suitable for a masonry structure or stone structure. And if you go inside this church, you will see a lot of interesting models. This is one of the models inside, and these chains were being tensioned and there's a mirror underneath, I took a photo from the mirror. And this would be the structure, Gaudi would use to build these structures. You can compare the two, you can see the architectural elements, they are very similar. And if you walk around Barcelona, you will see many of Gaudi's creations similar to this shape.

Mike Xie:Once we got our method, we can actually replicate what Gaudi did a hundred years ago very quickly, because when he created this models, it needs six or nine months in order to get a model working, and also he could only consider gravity. But, with our method you can put all the forces in, and to see, which areas are in tension you remove them. You will leave behind a structure, which will be suitable for the stone material. So, this will be what we get for the Passion Facade, which is very similar to what Gaudi's original joints, and what Mark Burry finally created using parametric studies.

Mike Xie:And it also depends on what forces you use. So, if we build this church in Shanghai, you would get a totally different shape, because in Barcelona the earth quake loading is small, but in Shanghai, Tokyo, the issue is, you have to have very high resistance to the lateral load. And we actually try that, if you put down very strong lateral ... The earth quake load, you would have additional bracings in order to resist forces in the horizontal direction. These are a series of studies I did with Mark Burry. So, if we want to create three columns on a slope, and starting from this by deleting the areas, which has highest tensile stress, within a few seconds, we can get a shape like this. If you go to Barcelona next time, have a close look at these columns on Passion Facade. And these columns have exact the shape as what we can get from our simple rule of Evolutionary Structure [inaudible 00:16:12]

Mike Xie:All we did is we start from any design like this, there's no bias. It only says there's three columns. If I remove areas in tension, you will get a shape, a beautiful shape, and just like we would see at the real church in Barcelona. In a 3D version, say, if we want to build a two columns on a flat surface, so you start from this, every time we remove the areas with the highest tensile stress, you get some strange looking column like this. And people can see that Gaudi as a genius, he actually got this design about a hundred years ago using his physical models. But if we go back to the basic mechanics and apply the simple rules of removing the tensile materials, we would get exactly the same shape as Gaudi did for his famous church in Barcelona.

Mike Xie:And later on we improved our method, in previously we can only remove the inefficient parts from the current design. We can actually do the reverse, say like the apple example, he can plant a seed and let the see to grow into apple so he can ... In structure terms, you can strengthen the most critical part in your structure by adding material to where it is most needed. Or we can do both ways, so you can start from any design then, while you are removing the most inefficient material, you can add those material to where it is critical. So we caught it Bi-Directional Evolutionary Structure Optimization method. So, it would be much faster and it's more efficient. So, I show you one simple example, say I want to design a bridge type of structure. So, I have a deck with uniformly distributed force, four points fixed at the corners, and I leave a gap in the middle so that vehicles can go through. All the rest will be decided by the computer where to put the material. And your initial design can be also very simple.

Mike Xie:So I have applied four columns, and this can also be a bridge, but no one will pay you consulting phase for designing something like this. It can break very easily, there's a stress concentration, but it doesn't matter, we can start from this initial design, and let the computer to decide where to add the material, and where to delete. So you are fine. Some of the earlier material added is removed later on. So, we are not doing some local modifications of a design. That's what people do in consulting office. They have a design and then do some assessments, “Oh, this part needs to be strengthened a little bit.” So, they do a simple change. We actually change a structure concept from this to that. It's not a simple local modification. The structural concepts of the two designs are completely different. We got an arch bridge with additional members like the tree branches we have repeated seeing in Gaudi's designs so that the whole structure has very uniform stress distribution and uniform structure performance.

Mike Xie:We have done many other examples, say this one is to design [kitchen 00:20:03] in a hotel, say you have four columns, you have very few column, you want to transfer the loads from a few columns to upper levels, and our process would enable you to find the best load transfer system, again, it's looks like what we see in nature, those tree branches. We can also do the dynamic optimization, say if we have vibration frequency through our process, we can find a design with a highest frequency, or you can increase the first three or five frequencies of the structure. We can have multiple constraints, for this building, we can minimize a deflection at the top of the building and also control the frequency.

Mike Xie:So, by redistributing this uniform shear walls, we get a bracing and the structure performance will be increased significantly not for both static and dynamic criteria. We have also tried to apply our technique to periodical structures. So, I show you one simple example, you will understand. So, this is a bridge say a few hundred meters long, but it's made of identical units. So, if we apply our rule by first say, divide the structure into a certain number of units. And when you change your one unit, you change the corresponding locations at all units, you will get a periodical optimal design. This example would be easier to understand say, this wheel has eight identical modules. When we apply our method, say, if want to do need any material here or the corresponding location, what have the material removed and you apply all the loads you were experiencing when you're driving the car.

Mike Xie:In our case, when you're accelerating or turning or breaking all the forces on the wheel will be different. You need to consider all the major load cases in order to decide which part needs to be removed or remain. Depending on how many cells you want, for a wheel you can get to do defend designs. And this was done by one of my PhD student. He got this pretty pictures, and then, I asked him whether these are correct or not. He walked around Melbourne street and took two photos and he found this. So, this is what he got using our simple Bi-Directional Evolution Structure of Optimization. These are Cadillac, BMW 17, They're almost identical.

Mike Xie:So, again, this is not a coincidence. This is because our design objectives, and BMW and Cadillac's, their objective are the same. We wanted design the lightest possible wheels, which has certain structure performance. So, they have spent maybe 40 or 50 years to improve their designs. But using our technique, we can develop the next generation of motor vehicles very quickly. Around the world these days, the electric vehicles is very popular, but the loading on the wheels are quite different because of the heavy batteries, the loading on these wheels will be completely different from what you see on BMW or Cadillac. But when we design a new wheel, we can apply this new conditions, and get a very close to the optimum design very quickly. And I started doing this work when I was in the Aeronautical Department in the University Sydney. And because weight reduction is of critical importance for aircraft, and that's why we have been working with Boeing and also Comac in China, tried to apply this technology to aircraft. We had several collaborative project with these companies.

Mike Xie:But strangely, I expected the people who become very excited about our technique was a group of architects. And so about 15 years ago, famous architects around the world started using our technique. I think it's mainly because of the organic shape we were able to create. It look so beautiful, it looks like what you see in nature. So, they started to make buildings, so this was the first building designed using extended Evolutionary Structure Optimization, which was based on my work. This was built in 2004 near Nagoya. There many other buildings, I give you a few.

Mike Xie:And some of you may heard that the Pritzker Architecture Prize, this is the highest price in architecture. It was award last week to a guy called Arata Isozaki. He actually was one of the first architect using our technique to design buildings. This one was in Qatar. It's actually very similar to the bridge example I showed you. If you're using our software, you fix this two points, put uniformly distribute load on the top, within a cup of tea, you will see this beautiful image on your screen. It's as simple as that. It's not just a beautiful picture, it has been built. This was a photo taken in 2012. I once passed Qatar airport, so I took a taxi and went to take this photo, so I took this one. So it has been built.

Mike Xie:And in China, Shanghai, there's another famous building, Himalayas Center, these strange shapes. Next time when you see it, it's not strange anymore. It's based on our simple rule of deleting inefficient material, and to get a different design. So, these are all based on the extended evolutionary structure optimization [master 00:27:01] I originally redeveloped. I have some other architecture friends who had been using my technique to build these different structures. This one has been done in Shanghai as well. I also tried to ... She mentioned that I was good at translating research into real project, but I tried and I failed terribly in Australia. I give you one failed example, it's a lesson I learned to move to the next step.

Mike Xie:So about 12 years ago, the VicRoads was doing a revamp of the Monash Freeway. There are several foot bridges, which they were calling for proposals. And I was very excited because we thought we could use our technique to design a better foot bridge for Malvern. I think we did a week ... We did a very good job. So, we were given the information, how wide the Monash Freeway was, 45 meters, and the boundary conditions. Depending on where you build a bridge, so if you're building against two solid rock, you would have this, if you are supporting here with a simple support, a roller, it will be a different structure.

Mike Xie:So, we did a series of studies. This is what we proposed to VicRoads. This is near Malvern station. So, next time you could have this bridge there in 2007, we presented it to VicRoads because this is really too dramatic, people haven't seen this kind of thing. This is before Isozaki built his structures in Qatar and Shanghai. So, VicRoads said, “Oh, look, it's impossible to build a bridge like this.” It's actually the [tech 00:29:06] is here so, if you walk through this bridge, it will be a really interesting visual experience. So, they said, “No way, this can't be built.” So, in their great wisdom, they built this. This is the Malvern station footbridge. So, they chose the safer way to construct this.

Mike Xie:I was very disappointed because actually it's not possible to build. I built one in the lab. It's building 10 in the old civil lab. The circle has six identical pieces. So, I made a reusable mode, this is timber mode, this foam will become the house. So, I put the steering reinforcement where the connections, putting the concrete six identical pieces I put on the boats, I can construct this very easily one to four scale section of that bridge. So, I wasn't successful to convince VicRoads. But in this check, retrospect, I can understand because this is something too ahead of the market, the market wasn't ready 10 years ago. But if I do this again now, I think I have a much better chance to convince people in their authority to take a risk and do something different in Malvern.

Mike Xie:I tried my hands in China as well. So, this is a proposal in [foreign language 00:30:49]. Again, this beautiful design is from a very simple rule of removing inefficient materials, redundant material from the structure. The byproduct of that simple process is this beautiful design. So, this is the proposal, we are still trying to get a build in China. And not that, we actually did a serious work. Last year I worked with a famous architecture firm in Shanghai called [Atilya Aqui 00:31:20] mixing. So, we proposed a series of foot bridges in Huangpu River, it's a famous river in Shanghai. We can also apply our technique to small scale structures. And so, this is a hot area of meta materials. So, by applying our technique we can, we can improve the material properties of this repeated periodical microstructures. In this case we have been maximize the back modules. So, under any pressure, this structure would have the least amount of volume change.

Mike Xie:The next one is a micro structure which can resist the shear stress. If you put on shear stress on this material because the material has been arranged on the diagonal direction, it can have very high shear resistance. Or we can design a micro microstructure with specified stiffness in different directions, like a bone, when you want to create a replacement for a piece of bone, you want that material to be having similar material properly like the bone being replaced. And normally you would have different stiffness in different directions. We can get exactly the same stiffness ratios by designing the microstructure. So, this is a functional grade it can have changes along the length and have a gradual change in the material property. And this is one of the material we have designed.

Mike Xie:So, normally, normal material when you have compression it will expand laterally. So, in our case, when you compress it, it actually shrink literally, so it does the opposite. So, this is [inaudible 00:33:37] material. And there've been a lot of papers written, but we were very early to be able to produce something which we can show to the people how it behaves. Another one, this is metal version of the [inaudible 00:33:59] material. So, the shapes are a little bit different from the rubber one. You can see a rugby ball shapes, so a horizontal one, a vertical one, this is a 3D, it's not just 2D, it's a Q. So, when you compress it, it will move in laterally. This kind of material has a lot of application in defense industry. We have some contract with the DSG, used to be caught DSTO trying to incorporate this kind of material to resist the strapping of penetration to armored vehicles.

Mike Xie:We have developed another material which behaves different from normal situation. So, normal material, when you put it on compression, it will shrink. So, in this case, I put my material in a freezer bag, and put a tube to suck the air out, which is the same as putting uniform pressure and the material. If I do that, if I suck the air out put the pressure, it actually expands on the pressure. And this is purely because we have designed our microstructure so it will have maximum deflection or deformation in a certain direction. So, I can change the shape of those cavities to make it grow in two directions. We have designed these kind of materials as well. So, you can make it grow in one or two direction. It's not possible to grow in three directions under uniform pressure. We can also make different holes, so that under any pressure, the length of the material will not change or the cross section area will not change. So, by simply changing the shape of the cavity through our optimization algorithms. So, this material has applications in biomedical field. We had to contract with [Wun 00:36:13] management CRC. It's because our special material like this.

Mike Xie:I'm going to talk about something. So, the connections in civil structures, they are very complicated and normally you need to say this are cast, these are weld. And one of the project we have been working with Arab is try to use 3D pending technology to realize these complex connections. So, traditionally we would design the columns and beams and in our project we would like to use standard steel columns, steel beams, but we designed every connection because you can find these forces in every member easily, and then, using this forces as input, you can design the connection. So your initial design could be a solid balL, and then let the computer decide, which area needs to be removed to make it lighter. So, this is one of the examples. So, I fix here, put a [banner 00:37:35] moment here, another banner moment there, then I can get rid of all the unnecessary material to produce the most efficient connection for this given loading condition. We have done many different notes. In this case, I fixed one point, put a shear force here, put a shear force, after you removed being efficient material, you got this beautiful connection. So, if we come to a future building, we are going to construct, when you come to a room, the connections are not like this boring squares. Every connection is a piece of artwork just like this.

Mike Xie:And these are some of the 3D printed metal notes. I have some at the back, when we finish, we can have a look. So, at RMIT, we are very proud of the facility we have at the AMP, Advanced Manufacturing Printing, we can print many off our notes. So, this was done at AMP, this was done somewhere else. But, there's one critical thing about the metal printing, although you can say, oh, it can be done, but there's two ... When I brought this note back to Mike, my friends who are doing the real project in the field, they asked me tWo questions, A; How much does it cost? B; Can you certify your note? The first question, I did some calculation, I give him the prize. It's about a thousand or more times of the normal price they were to use in the construction industry. The second one is the possible defect in this metal printed parts. So, eventually I stopped doing the direct metal printing started to do the casting, because you can print the same model using wax very cheaply, and you can print very large wax models.

Mike Xie:So, in Huangzhou University of Science Technology, they can print those wax models 1.2 meters big. Or if it's three meters you can print two pieces and stick to wax model together. Then with the wax model, you can create a shell outside the wax model, and that Shell can be used to cast metal. So, the next one is the shell. So, this is a ceramic shell you can get after you dipping your wax model into the ceramic slurry and let it dry. You do that several time, you get this very solid shell, and you can pull the molten steel into this.

Mike Xie:So, this is a very good image, it was taken in Malvern three years ago. It looks like a medieval 300 years old picture. The process of casting has been there for hundreds of years, but people are still doing this. But this is a perfect combination of traditional casting technology with modern techniques here. So, here we actually used the lightest topology optimization technique to create the shape. We used a 3D printing to print the wax. And so the advanced manufacturing technology is here, but the last step is casting, and this, we have several examples on display at the back. So, when you see this note, this one was cast. And also two questions I was asked, one the price, this would cost a small fraction of the direct metal printing node. The other thing is because the last step is done through traditional casting technology. It can be used tomorrow because there's standards people have been using casting for real projects for many, many years.

Mike Xie:So, I have 10 more minutes. I will go quickly about some of other [fans 00:42:08] we have been doing. So, the topology optimization technique can be used for many things. We actually made some jewelries, but I deleted that picture. I show you some of the furniture's we have made. This is a stool we made so by applying the load, then we can get this structure, we can 3D print. If you come to my office, you can see some of the tables, my student made for me.

Mike Xie:So, this is jamming and one of the student there. He made this table for me using our technique, using our software to remove the inefficient materials. I want to show you the slight difference. Initially I want to make a table using 3D printing. So, we generate this shape, I send it to print, the bill came back, this leg costs me 700 Australian dollars. So, if I want to have a table with four legs, it's almost $3,000. It's too much, or it didn't get the budget, Xing didn't give me any additional support for that. So, I changed the strategy, so instead of doing the full 3D printing, this is a 2D laser cutting so, it's made of four plates. So, it's a 2D plate, you do laser cutting and it can be flat packed. It takes very small volume and the whole thing cost about $100, that one will be $3,000. And we bought a table top, the glass $99. So, this is $200 table, it looks very nice.

Speaker 3:[inaudible 00:44:00]

Mike Xie:Sorry.

Speaker 3:[inaudible 00:44:03]

Mike Xie:The table top is from Ikea, but that advanced technologies underneath the glass, we want the glass so that we can see what's there. And the other issue is this four plates, we need to have the glue to glue them together, which is actually very tedious because you need to have two people hold it and wait for a lot of time. So, we improved it. So this one has three plates, we use a tough tower system. So the three plate, you can just slot into each other, they can assemble them. So, he can put it in a suitcase because it's so small volume, and when you get there, you can assemble it.

Mike Xie:We also tried our method to [June. 00:44:57] So, this is the initial design and you apply the load when you fly, you're turning the force is on the four propellers are quite different, so you feel when taking off. So, some of the loads in one propeller will be much higher than the rest. So, I think we consider maybe around 15 load cases and removed the inefficient parts, we can get a very light weight and organic June, just like this. It flew perfectly, we tried this in our campus. It's also at the back. We didn't bring the battery, otherwise we could fly in the room here, I could show you.

Mike Xie:I actually tried very hard to put some of my technology into real structures, I'm making some progress. So, this is one of the project we have design. So, in this one we designed 48 tree top column, just like what Gaudi did in Barcelona. We are having this to 200 meter buildings to be completed in the next few months with 48 trees just like this. And the wanting, why? It's me. I was so proud to inspect my team's work when this mock up, this one to one model was built about 18 months ago.

Mike Xie:This is one of our current job. So, this is Observation Tower overlooking a famous lake in China. And this was designed by architect and the owner wasn't quite satisfied, he said, "Oh, we want to create a landmark building for this structure. Can you find someone who can do better?" So, people refer to us, they know we like doing some crazy things. So, we started redesign this Observation Tower. So, this is about 150 meters or 200 meters? About 200 meters. So, there's two lifts going up, there is artificial wetland here. And so, first we need to set up all the loads. So, you have the gravity on the tower, you have the forces on each floor, and the lifts and the artificial wetland winds from four directions. Once we put all the forces in, we can start to evolve, to generate different designs. So, again, by deleting those inefficient materials we can come up with a total different design. So, this is one of the proposals. We can actually control the member sizes to make a sticker. So, this is one design, in another one, it's a similar process, but with thicker members. So, these are some of our proposals so I just go quickly. We are hoping to get this built in the next few years.

Mike Xie:And there's one thing we realized through our work is we need to have much closer collaborative relationship with the architect. Because traditionally in China, in Australia, in many countries, the architect would produce a design, and then they give it to the structural engineer to say, 'Look, you design the thing to make sure it doesn't fall." But the structural engineer wouldn't be able to make much changes to the shapes or forms of the design. But if you're able ... I'm mainly a structure engineer, but if we are able to get involved in the project very early, so before they decided that the design, you need to start to talk with the architect in order to co-design that project, then that would make a big difference.

Mike Xie:In this case, we actually have been talking to the architects very constantly, like when we produced this design, the architects said, "No." Because this is Observation Tower, I can't a solid wall here. You need to have transparency, you need to able to see through. We can achieve that by simply putting a thicker walls at the bottom. If you use a thicker plates, you can get additional holes in these phases. So it's only a matter of proper dialogue rather than just one way flow. It's a two way dialogue in order to come up with a design, satisfying both the architecture intention and a structure performance.

Mike Xie:One of our current researches, when we deal with a mathematicians and when we do optimization, they always say, "Is your solution the absolute best or the unique solution?" That's what the mathematicians want to ask. But these days, actually I want to do exactly the opposite. I don't want a single solution, I want many solutions. That's because I've been working with architects, they hate to give a solution, I've got the best solution if that's a case, what's their job? They want choice, they want input. So, what we want to do is to create many solutions, all the solutions that look dramatically different, but in terms of structure performance, they're very close. So, this is something, and we have made some good progress. So, this Qatar Convention Center, if we only consider the structure performance, we will get something like this. But because this is the existing design, we can't build this in Melbourne or Shanghai. It's has been there, people have been winning awards.

Mike Xie:But the situation is quite common. You have to support uniformly distributed load. For given boundary and loading conditions, we want to create a different looking design. This is what we have achieved because this is a existing solution. Any material which has already appeared in the previous designs, I would penalize it. So, by doing that I get it quite different results. So, this is the additional trust and the structure performance of this is actually very close to that. Another, example say, I have uniformly distributed load on this tech, and if I only consider structure performance, you get two arches, if I penalize the material which has already appeared in this design, I get the second design where the two arches are coming together.

Mike Xie:If I penalize both existing design, I get another one. The third one, the two arches become one and the three looks quite different, but in terms structure performance they're within 3% if you consider their stiffness. So although they look different, from structural engineering point of view, they are very similar. So, that's why we call it diverse and competitive designs. And I'll go very quickly, we have developed some software called Amoeba. It's been running on the Cloud. It can create all these structures very quickly. So, this is how we can design the stool, and this is a 2D version of a chair and there are some of other things. So, I'm very lucky to have so many talented students, and probably 15 of them are here so they have contributed to the work, and we are making some new progress in our team. So, thank you very much.

Xinghuo Yu:[inaudible 00:53:49] So all different kind of discipline areas and they create some of the fascinating structures. So, now we just open for some questions, any questions and comments? There.

Speaker 4:Does your method always converge to a solution that's stationary or do you just have to decide on an arbitrary stopping point?

Mike Xie:We actually have to get them to converge. So, we look at the objective function. If the objective function do not change much for 10 steps, we stop. So, we have a criteria to decide when to stop. It's always we have a very flat line to make sure it converges.

Speaker 4:Thank you.

Xinghuo Yu:Thank you. Any more questions? Yes. Can we have the ... Sorry, can we have the speak [inaudible 00:55:00]

Speaker 5:Okay. Thank you. In designer category or structure, if the minimal size constraint and specify the volume fraction, can we get solution which matches [seratical 00:55:19] solution very well?

Mike Xie:To prove our algorithm is working, we have actually compared a lot of benchmark examples to show that our simple rules can produce those analytical designs. We have done that in both static and dynamic examples.

Xinghuo Yu:Alright. Okay. Can we pass on that to speaker.

Speaker 6:Thank you for the example. I'm just wondering [inaudible 00:55:57] Well, your design is dependent on electro materials that are used, and if you can use a combination of different materials and how many materials you can incorporate into one design, if it's a constraint or?

Mike Xie:It heavily depends on the material you use, like what I showed, whether it should be suitable with tension or compression. You can have multiple materials, because our technique is a simple post processing [inaudible 00:56:25] It's actually whatever you can analyze using finite element software, we can process the output and make changes. So, your problem could be nonlinear, material could large deformation, as long as you have considered this in your analysis, you can do modifications to get a new design and put it back for the analysis to assess its performance.

Speaker 6:But, if I can add to this, the practicality of things like their boundaries between materials, they would be susceptible to deformation or stress, how this is accounted for?

Mike Xie:We haven't considered these details as I keep it mind.

Speaker 6:Thank you.

Xinghuo Yu:Okay. Thank you very much. Yes, there's some other questions from there.

Speaker 7:Thanks Mike. Just a quick question. When you analyze the structure and then you change the shape, do you restart from initial condition or how does it work or do you just keep going the analysis, especially if it's nonlinear. Do you start from scratch when you change the shape?

Mike Xie:We actually continue. Yeah, if it's nonlinear it's far more complicated, you really need to go back again to do it. We haven't done many nonlinear examples, but we did some nonlinear materials. Both are possible, but the result will be different because it's past dependent then. We can do both ways to see what difference we will get.

Speaker 7:Thank you.

Xinghuo Yu:Okay. Oh, well there's another one questions.

Speaker 8:Thank you. It's a very interesting presentation. My question is regarding construction prefabrication, because that's getting more and more popular in the construction industry. Have you considered to inform the lean manufacturing stage for that, ratio design and the optimal solution for the structure, whether that can be considered also to inform the lean manufacturing stage?

Mike Xie:One of the things we can contribute is the aspect I mentioned about the periodical structures, because the prefabrication, you have many identical components, and we can make this identical component. If we can save a small amount for that component because it's producing set such a large number we can achieve a lot of savings. So, we have thinking about along this line.

Speaker 8:Maybe bathroom poles so it's kind of things.

Mike Xie:Could be.

Xinghuo Yu:Okay. Thank you. Yes, there's another question.

Speaker 9:I've a non engineering question. So, because obviously, so you've got the architect that is using the software to produce a very unique looking design, but the design uniqueness is actually sort of inherent to the actual software. So, the software in itself is geared towards this very specific design aesthetic. Does it mean that as a design professional, there is a possibility of coming across IP problems by using the software from multiple design firms because you will inevitably get, although you say they look different, they may not look sufficiently different from plagiarism point of view.

Mike Xie:I guess, it's self regulating, if they are aware that some similar firm being built, they wouldn't produce something similar [crosstalk 01:00:55] That's why the diverse solution becomes so important. We can actually have some random process every time you write because we have put some random modifications to the same material properties, every time you get totally different random design, but we make sure that the structure performance is not sacrificed, although you get random shapes, but every design has very high structure performance.

Speaker 9:But, I'm thinking more from the actual aesthetic point of view. Is there a way to modify, so let's say as an architect, you can have a very specific, We call it design, thumbprint, so design some print?

Mike Xie:Yeah.

Speaker 9:So, it's literally like a thumbprint that recognizes you as a designer because the Japanese designer seems to be using that very natural shape and it's become his signature look. So, is there a way to modify the algorithms so you can have your own, the algorithm takes your signature look into or it will develop some sort of a signature look.

Mike Xie:You can actually specify some regions, some examples, you can say, in your design you can actually put RMIT in the design and that RMIT is always remaining there, and you can say this area has to be a hole or that area has to be solid. And all these things, the designers or architect can control on the screen. So, it's not just a black box, we want to avoid a black box to, we want to empower the architects to use our tools.

Xinghuo Yu:Given the time, we might just stop here so you can still talk to Mike after we have some refresh after those. So please join me to thank Mike for the fascinating talk. All right.

Xing:This is the second and the last distinguished lecturer in RMIT we have sort of organized. I am [inaudible 00:00:11]. I am the chair of RMIT [inaudible 00:00:14] Academy. So, this is one of the mission we have, is to promote excellence of research, and also stimulate the discussions, talk about issues of international importance, and of course, create an environment for us to talk together and work together.

Xing:So today it is my pleasure to have distinguished professor [inaudible 00:00:36] to give the distinction lectures on livable, sustainable cities, which is very interesting to me as well. I have seen that quite a few from science engineers, and certainly that [inaudible 00:00:54]. I don't want to introduce Billie too much, but you all know that Billie is the director of the ECP-Urban Futures, this is one of the key issues that Urban Futures addresses. Billie is an outstanding researcher, I don't want to raise the [inaudible 00:01:18] as a very quantitative person, I think the number.

Xing:Check your numbers you have 260 publications, 11,156 citations, [inaudible 00:01:28] 52, and you're right in the highly cited researcher in the top 1% in the world. So really congratulations, we are very fortunate to have you. Without any delay, please join me to welcome Billy to give her lecture.

Billie:Google results, because the Google Scholar ones are even better.

Xing:This is better, this is web of science.

Billie:So thanks so much for coming, I know how busy it is at this time of year to fit in another lecture, but it's really nice to see you here, and thanks so much to Xing for the very nice introduction.

Billie:What I'm going to talk about is my own research, obviously the enabling capability platform director at RMIT my job is to enable the capability of the university to solve conflicts and problems.

Billie:There's no question in my mind that creating healthy, livable, sustainable cities is an obvious and apparent problem and it requires all hands on deck. It's not going to happen without all of the people who work in the building [inaudible 00:02:38] working together, us using the best technology to monitor the city, there's so many things that need to be done to create better cities.

Billie:I want to give you the why, what, and how, not that I've got all the answers, but to demonstrate why this is such a multi-disciplinary problem. Now I'm sure all of you would be sleeping under a mushroom if you didn't know that Melbourne was the most livable city there ever was, until we got our crown stolen by Vienna. And the question that [inaudible 00:03:11] is is this measure of livability fit for purpose, what does it tell us about Melbourne truly?

Billie:It's interesting when we unpack the index itself, there's 30 measures, 26 of them are politics. So about 6 are about the products of crime, it doesn't measure it, it rings up the night still, and Melbourne is safe. Any comment they make, no mate, that's okay. Any conflicts it's asks about culture and environment. I love this one about culture and environment: humidity, temperature rating. Is it discomfort of climate to travelers? And that's because this particular index is for executives when they're trying to decide what learning should thy give an executive when they're relocating to a city, they use the intelligence, a common intelligence unit to decide what they're learning will be.

Billie:So if you're going to some countries, Africa, some African countries, you get a 20% learning, and when you come to Melbourne or any Australian city, no learning. So if you're an expat going somewhere else its going to give you a bit of learning. It asks about education, and that's of interest to some sorts of people. Available private education, quality of private education. So truly if were thinking about livability of Melbourne is this index fit for purpose?

Billie:Now in the health sector we've been thinking about the way we design cities and the impact on health. In the last 15 years, quite seriously. There always was a relationship between the way we design cities and health, you know during industrialization the concern was about air quality, crowding, all the things that came with rapidly industrializing the city. It was really to do with infectious disease, but in the 21st century the issues are more to do with chronic disease.

Billie:I'd like to put this image up, this was cover, we were on the cover of Lancet. Now in our field it's not like publishing in Nature, or Science, which for those in the scientific fields are really aspiring to, but when you get published in Lancet you feel like you've really made it. And we got the cover. This is not us in the picture, but the image behind this is of New York, we went to launch of our special series of lancet on urban design transport and health.

Billie:So I want to present it to you because I want you to see why we think in health the way we design cities is so important in the 21st century relating to chronic disease. So I had the first paper on how to balance [inaudible 00:05:40] in the paper there was a number of people from across the world. So it was a multidisciplinary, multi-country endeavor. And what our job was was to lay the foundation for this particular series, and look at what does the evidence tell us about how city planning can affect population health and to outline what the challenges were.

Billie:Well the obvious thing that's happening in cities for the first time in human history, since 2008, 50% of people are living in cities, used to be 10% of people in the 1900s, and now it's 50%. In 2050 it's estimated it's going to be 66%, so we've got both rapidly growing populations by 2050 we estimates are we'll be 9.5 billion on the globe. But we've also got urbanization, and something that puts a lot of pressure on cities, clearly, because that's where everyone is flocking to, and the question is are we going to accommodate those rapidly growing populations, and do it in a way that protects the health and well-being.

Billie:And this is not just a global problem of course, because in Melbourne, by 2050 it's estimated that we're going to be 8 million, and we already see the discussions going on about the pressures of the city, the traffic congestion, the inequality that's being caused both out of suburban, inner-areas, so there's lot of issues that cities have [inaudible 00:07:02] to deal with.

Billie:But from a health perspective in addition to those big picture sustainability managing population growth issues, there's a whole range of other issues in the 21st century that cities need to deal with. The levels of chronic disease, now in a global perspective that's really important because what's happened of course, as countries become more wealthy, they've also got the diseases of wealth.

Billie:Used to be that in lower-income countries they dealt with infectious disease, but now they're living with chronic disease, and often they're dealing with infectious disease with chronic disease at the same time. But the chronic diseases are very expensive, and it's putting a lot of pressure on the health systems throughout the globe.

Billie:Rising levels of chronic disease is a big issue for health systems across the globe. Rising levels of depression, and it could be that we're measuring it better, it could be that people have always been depressed, but there is growing concerns about the rising levels of depression. Road traffic injuries, this is the 8th leading cause of death and disability globally. And it's becoming a bigger issue of course, through wealth, through countries getting more and more vehicles.

Billie:Air pollution, this is the biggest environmental hazard for health that we have. WHO has come out now and said this is a growing issue, I've got a couple of slides on that later. As our cities become more urbanizing, rising levels of noise, noise is a huge issue in Europe, and as we've got more people moving into the inner-city that will become a bigger issue. People are feeling socially isolated, and that has a big impact on people's mental health.

Billie:And when cities grow, people become more fearful, and constrain [inaudible 00:08:52], they're worried about going out today, they're constrained both by physical behavior, so being physically active, and also their social behavior. And that has a big impact on both their physical and mental health. And this rising level of inequities.

Billie:The haves and have nots, so we have cities now where we have growing levels of inequity. And we see it in a special way in Australia with our out of suburban areas not having nearly as much amenity as we have in the inner city. But income inequity is a major issue, and we ignore that at our peril is the way I put it. We cannot ignore inequity because when we have inequity we have such a disruption, so even if we're taking a selfish view rather than a more social view, rising levels of health and inequity are a major issue.

Billie:Now this has been recognized globally, the United Nations set development goals, really puts the role of city planning front and center of it's major goals. It has of course got 11, which is around cities and human settlements, so that's where we all live, but actually if you look across the whole document you can see that city planning, and health, are picked up across 9 goals, and 24 targets. So it's very much embedded in if we're going to achieve a more sustainable plan, cities have got to be a part of this.

Billie:Now, the other part of this is that in 2016, and [inaudible 00:10:22] was here, he was at [inaudible 00:10:24] of a team of people from IT. This is where the new urban agenda was launched, and this is clear recognition that if we are going to have a more sustainable future cities have got to be part of this, because that's where all the people are flocking to and we have to have cities as a city planner is clearly recognized, and what I like about this is, you might know about the urban futures planbook and their building platform, is they've actually put these words into it and it sounds awfully complicated, but what they say if we want to have a sustainable future, we have to reconsider the way cities are planned, designed, financed, developed, governed, and managed.

Billie:Now if that's not a multidisciplinary problem, I'm not sure what is. It means that everyone needs to help do that because were not going to be able to help get the cities that we need for 21st century unless were addressing this from a multidisciplinary perseverative. But it's not just the UN its also the OACD talks about pedestrian safety, urban space, and health, and I love this one. This a little quote from this, this is in 2012, because, it's sort of, it made the point that transport ministers and health ministers need to be involved in putting in the technical administrative, and regulatory framework that will promote the simple act of walking.

Billie:Because we've designed walking, active modes, out of the transportation system. We've really been designing cities for the car. And on that school, just to emphasize the point, it also put out this report in 2017 talking about the rising cost of air pollution. Thus far in the 21st century, so this is looking only at what's happened in the 21st century, 2017, the 21st century burden of air pollution in 41 countries was 3.2 million deaths and around 5.1 trillion dollars in 2015. So between 2000 and 2015 it's cost 5.1 trillion dollars because of air pollution.

Billie:And most of the air pollution is coming from transport, because transport is the largest contributor to air pollution in cities. So we're not talking about something that's trivial, so depending on what you're interested in, if you're interested in a social view, a health view, it looks pretty bad. If you're interested in an economic view, you see its costing us a lot of money, and if you're interested in environmental issues, we've got a big problem on our hands where we can see people actually dying from the fact that were driving our vehicles at the rate we are in cities.

Billie:So these are big issues, of course, the big discussion that goes on, it's been in the NYT at the moment, is about well, worry about population growth lets curb migration. Big issue. Can we do that? Can we curb migration, is that the solution? Is that to suggest that only some people, I saw this cartoon in the paper the other day, some of you are causing congestion, this is a Scott Morrison, so this is a ridiculous idea that we curb migration as a way of solving our population growth issues.

Billie:It's true that we have a lot of growth through immigration, but actually when we look at the details of that, two things emerge. One is that we only have 2.5% of our immigration is through humanitarian immigration, and I can't imagine that in the future we're not going to need to have more migration to deal with humanitarian problems that were dealing with globally. Social disruption from climate change and war, all sorts of problems we see across the globe, can't imagine that Australia is going to be able to avoid that in the future.

Billie:But in addition to that we have an aging population, in Australia, taking a selfish view, this is looking at a high growth scenario of what the average age of the population will be. So this is looking at Tasmania. With a high-growth scenario, so that's upper ring, so that's having a lot of migration. Even then were seeing that we're getting up to the average age, median age, being almost 50 by 2030. So big issue we've got an aging population, and this is the thing if we go for a low growth strategy, so we curb our immigration and have low growth, and this is the upper level here, this is really if we go through the low growth by 2030, 2031, this is wat the ages are going to be. Here we're getting up to almost 50 in the low growth strategy, 2031, in 2061 we have got a major issue we don't have immigration because we have an aging population.

Billie:If we don't have a population growth and we're not having immigration were going to have an aging population and many fewer people who are employed who can keep the economy going. So again if we take a view, a selfish view, immigration is a really big part of what we need to have in our cities, the question is how do we manage that growth. Which is the major issue, because we need to increase the number, maintain the number of skilled workers, and also the number of working age populations.

Billie:The other issue of course is we could manage our growth rather than manage our migration manage our congestion. And I like this image, this is an image of the busy city, so some people talk to us about what we should be doing with our vehicles is moving over to electric vehicles or, autonomous vehicles, and I like this image that appeared on twitter the other day, because this is what it looks like when we've got cars, this is what it looks like when we've got electric cars, this is what it could look like if we have autonomous cars, this is what it's going to look like when we have uber.

Billie:So depending on the decisions we make in terms of our policy, and government diversity, we're going to end up with all these scenarios regardless of the technology it's really up to us as citizens and researchers to look at what's going to the be the best way of governing this to actually use the technology to truly manage the city, but it's going to require governance. Its going to require, what are going to be the rules for the autonomous vehicles coming, what will be the rules that we use, what will be the governance that we put in place to deliver a good outcome for cities. Cause I'm pretty sure that the car manufacturers have probably got one thing in mind when they're thinking about autonomous vehicles, that all of us hopefully have our own car, because that's the business model. I can't imagine that we're not going to need to manage this.

Billie:So again putting our minds to this to come up with the best possible solutions for our cities, so we need to think about this in terms of again, it's multidisciplinary, a technical solution, a policy solution, and social solutions all of these need to be in mind to produce the best results for our cities.

Billie:Of course, I think this picture of Jack and Jill, I think this is a Tesla image, I have to think whats going to happen to these guys if this is what the future is, them having an autonomous vehicle, what's going to the be health impact of that. We're already dealing with chronic disease, this cars going to come up to your door, get in your car, sit down, lie down, not even concentrate on driving, just lay back, goodness knows what's going to happen to health impacts in the long term if we don't think carefully about what were going to do with autonomous vehicles.

Billie:The chronic disease impacts the medical impacts, I think it will be enormous and hopefully we'll learn about that in some of our research in the next little while. Now, none of these ideas are particularly new actually, in 2011 there was a high [inaudible 00:18:47] in the UN about how were going to manage, I mention this big issue about rising levels of chronic disease, and they have a [inaudible 00:18:58] on the prevention and control of noncommunicable diseases. And what they said, which I think was really important, is that unless we can manage chronic disease, we're going to undermine the social and economic growth of our economies because the costs of actually fixing people up when they're preventable diseases is so great, and what were seeing in the developing countries, now seeing that infectious disease and chronic disease are actually gripping our hospitals.

Billie:I like this report because when I'm talking to my policy maker colleagues, because what it said is the house sector can't deal with this, the health sector is not going to be able to deal with these problems because all the other sectors outside of the health sector that create the conditions for good or poor health. So for example, in the health sector, what we do, is we are talking about what to do, eat a healthy diet, be physically active, don't smoke. Or we patch people up when they're sick, so if they don't follow that advice, we put them in the hospital, and we help them get well. Or we look after that when they're sick.

Billie:It's really all the other sectors that create the opportunities/the conditions for global health. And that's what this is saying, it's said that if were going to solve this problem we need to have engagement from all sectors of society, and to generate an effective response, and it needs to be multidisciplinary and multi-sector. So you may not think this in your own jobs, own future, own research, that decisions you make will have a health impact, but they may well, they're likely to.

Billie:And its a new way of thinking that it's all the other sectors that actually create the conditions on whether people live healthy, or unhealthy, lives. And this is important because we've got growing levels of inequity, and in this report that came out by the WHO, it suggests that the importance of social determinants of health, we need to be putting health and health equity at the hearts of our city governments, we need to be thinking about what will be the unintended health impact of the decisions we make.

Billie:Autonomous vehicles being one, I'm very keen that we start to think right now, not just of the technical solution, but what would be the social solution to this. It's not saying just don't have it, it's saying lets do it in a way that will produce an outcome we'll be proud of. On our watch were either going to create cites that promote good health and well-being, and good mental health, or not. So really it's about trying to think of these things up front and try to manage that. We won't always get it right, but we should be thinking of these before we just put the technology out there.

Billie:The WHO has said to close the gap to reduce inequity, we need to be thinking about placing health and health equity at the heart of all our city planning decisions. And this was reinforced in their Shanghai Declaration, talking about sustainable development goals, they've said for decades now, they've been talking about cities as a critical center for health, and they affirmed this, but they said, and I think its a really good quote, that health should be one of the most effective markers of any cities successful sustainable development, should be the health and well being of the people who live in those cities, and if we can't get that right, we're not really doing effective sustainable development.

Billie:Now, I've framed this around the paper that we did for the Lancet series, now Lancet was interesting because just one of the solutions about those cities is to really foster the alternative to driving, walking slightly to public transport use, and that's what we focused our paper on. But what was interesting about the Lancet which is very conservative if you'd like, it's a medical journal, and tends to be you know, gotta do everything right, they said we want you to go outside of bounds, we want you to not just write a completely academic, of course it's an academic paper, but they said we want you to push the boundaries, give us a sense of not just what the problem is, but how we're going to fix it.

Billie:Which really pushed us to think through bringing our research together, bringing together these multidisciplinary teams to think of it, and what we said was we need to have 8 integrated planning and transport dimensions, and I want to talk you through those. First of all, we're built on the work of the transportation planners, and overplanners, radioing in [inaudible 00:23:43] of era, and they've come up with the notion of [inaudible 00:23:45]IDs about how we should design cities to promote health and well being. Now we separated those out, and came up with the 8Ds we'd like to improve on, whatever everyone else has done, but we think it made sense what we proposed.

Billie:What we said is that if we want to build better cities, and to be honest in the health sector what we've tended to do is to focus on the local urban design, we said yeah, you need to do the local urban design, think about the design of the street networks, the levels of density that would optimize health, how close transit is, the diversity of housing, and how desireable it is, is it attractive? Do people feel fearful because of crime? Is it got [inaudible 00:24:27] and camping, can people walk and feel safe?

Billie:But in addition to that we needed to be thinking about [inaudible 00:24:32] planning. How are we going to get to drive, what's the quality of the transportation system, the public transportation system, that will get people to employment. Where is the employment, is it all in the center of the city, or is it spread throughout the city, so the distribution of employment. What's the demand management, I alluded to this a little with the comments to autonomous vehicles, but how are we going to diminish the demand, is it just free do people just do what they like, or is there congestion charging, or is there high cost parking that discourages people? Is there low cost public transport, that means people are more attracted to public transport.

Billie:These are all sort of demand management strategies, and again that requires the agro-scientist to be involved in those sorts of decision making. What we felt was this is a package of activities that need to go on, not just one, but a combination of things you need to create a better city, but we're not going to get that unless we can actually do things up front.

Billie:So we needed to have upstream activities, and we needed to be thinking about all the urban systems that create city, and align integrated planning across all of this. Transport, health services, where infrastructure is going to go, where the employment is going to go, [inaudible 00:25:48] planning. If you're in engineering you probably don't talk to the planners, the engineers and planners don't talk together. I saw, we had someone visiting from Finland, she's got one of the first programs where they're bringing land use and transport planning together. Oh heaven, that's really great, we should be doing that at RMIT, something for us to think about.

Billie:So, all these systems need to be integrated if we're going to have a good outcome, because together they produce the intimations that create the city. Which affect our transportation mode choices, identity outcomes, what we have access to in terms of employment, food, services, demand for different modes of transport, but in particular, a transportation mode of choice, whether we walk, cycle, use public transport, whether we drive.

Billie:Now, why are these important from a health point of view. We argue that these 8 exposures, 8 risk exposures to health, the amount of traffic there is, air quality, noise, social isolation, the crime that people experience, and then behavioral factors, whether people are inactive in their mode of choice, do they drive, do they sit, or whether they have access to healthy food. These are all behavioral risk factors, these are the social risk factors, and these are the environmental ones.

Billie:Now they're important because they affect our health. So for example, traffic, the obvious one affects traffic incidents and road trauma, which can have a detrimental impact on health. But traffics also important because of the impact on air quality. And air quality affects green house gas emissions, particular climate change, and it also has a number of health impacts that are caused by air quality: respiratory disease, heat stress, infectious disease, mental illness, all of these are impacted by the quality of the air.

Billie:But traffic is also important because of noise. Noise can impact social isolation impact on mental ill health. And then if people feel personally unsafe they can strain their behavior and that affects their social isolation. And together with all chronic disease factors, that impacts on our chronic disease, and ultimately our overweight, and overall well being.

Billie:So it's a system I've implied, it's a linear system, it's not a linear system, but we've presented it that way. But we're trying to make the point that the decisions we make around the cities, the integration of our policies, impact on health and well being of people down the track. And unless we want to do something about our chronic disease, our health and well being, we need to be doing things upstream to protect the conditions of good health.

Billie:Now what we've argued is if were going to achieve that we need integrated governments across a city. So in the past we haven't done this particularly well, we need integrated governance around transport and land use, employment, housing, all sort of social infrastructure, public safety. We need all these policies to be working together, which is why what's great with the ACP, we're trying to get multidisciplinary teams to solve these complex problems. We won't solve them unless different disciplines are working together.

Billie:Now, we've argued, [inaudible 00:29:16] is that the reason we need these 8 integrated systems is because that's what's required to create a livable city, and we've defined a livable city, and it's an inclusive definition, not like the [inaudible 00:29:30], we've said that a livable city is one that's safe, and socially cohesive and inclusive, it has to be environmentally sustainable. We can't continue just to build our cities the way they are, they're not environmentally sustainable. Of course we need to have affordable housing, but there's no point just providing that affordable housing on the fringe of cities if it's not linked by public transport or cycling infrastructure to all the things you need for daily life, access to employment, access to shops and services, access to public owned space, recreational opportunities. These are all the things we need for daily living.

Billie:So, just putting out affordable housing on the fringe of our cities is not actually solving our problems, it's putting more roads, it's enhancing inequity, it's meaning that people are living there without all the things they need for daily living. The question is how do we change that. So to encourage active transport and achieve the new urban agenda, what we've argued is that we need 8 integrated urban policies because they're needed to create the 8 urban transport planning intimations, and they are important because they affect 8 city related risk exposures.

Billie:Now, we didn't actually come up with the 8, it just sort of worked out that way, that was beautifully done, we were very clever in coming up with that. It just worked out that way. But that's going to require integrated governments. Now, the simple part of what I'm going to talk about is how you work with this, in our research we came up with the notion that what gets measured will get done, and we needed to be measuring.

Billie:So, we've been measuring walk ability, we've been using walk ability, geographic measuring systems to create measures of a built in environment for decades, but we've never really given it back to anyone, we've never given it to our policy maker colleagues, we've never made It public, we've just kept it on our computers, but now what were doing is starting to visualize this and give it out.

Billie:So this is our map of Melbourne. And you can see inner Melbourne, of course is very livable very nice and walkabout, but any yellow out to red that's where you start to get people driving, and anything that is yellow to red people only drive, there is no other choices. So what we planned is that we needed to be collecting information on the legislation of polices, the government investment in different types of transport, all the interventions and then all the outcomes to be able to monitor that.

Billie:Now, we've been doing some of that work here in Melbourne and I wanted to share that with you. This is the [inaudible 00:32:15] many of them in the audience now who've contributed to the research, and we've had funding from a number of different resources, from a central resource excellence, which is finishing this Thursday, to the Australian election partnership center, and the clean air and landscape, they've all contributed funding to fund the research that I'm going to present.

Billie:We've done lots of testing out of all the different measures, so everything I'm presenting here [inaudible 00:32:38] to work for our CRE, we've got a lot of papers behind us, so we haven't thought of this yesterday. This has been a long series of work. We want to test out, public health tends to be very evidence based, we want to test out the indicators. Do these policy relevant indicators of the building [inaudible 00:32:59] do they promote health? So we've been testing those out.

Billie:And we've used those in a report we've done nationally, the creating livable cities report, which was published in 2017. This work was led by Jonathon Arandelle. We had funding from multiple sources, and partnership with RN, and researchers from a number of different universities. We did a couple of different things in this, we reviewed in the policy. If we want to change cities, we have to understand the policy and environment in which we're working, so what we did first, we reviewed all the evidence around policies in the 4 states: [inaudible 00:33:37], Victoria, New South Wales, and Queensland.

Billie:And we wanted to create indicators of the main intention of policy and to assist the level of policy implementation, to give us a sense of do we have the policy frameworks in place to deliver better cities, and to whom are those policies being delivered. So that was the first part. We also created a set of national health related indicators. So the health related indicators were the ones Hannah had worked on. So we looked at which indicators, that were policy relevant, but might not be in every state, policies that were being delivered in that state, but which indicators would promote health.

Billie:So if you had a policy for this, we'd test it out and see if promoted health. The ones we tested out were the ones that we found were most likely to promote health, and we wanted to map and look at the spacial distribution, and make some recommendations. So we only focused on a set number of domain sustainability: we looked at public open space, transport, walk ability, housing affordability, employment, food environment, and alcohol environment. The alcohol environment really came from our partner, one of the partners was a [inaudible 00:34:53] partnership center particularly interested in people's access to alcohol.

Billie:The others are more interested in the urban planning type of indicators. And it's interesting because it's quite hard to do a study like this because it's a national study and getting the data together was a major challenge. So just to give you a sense of the sorts of things were looking at, for example, in Victoria, the Victorian transport policy is that 95% should live within 400 meters of a bus stop, 800 meters of a train stop, or 600 meters from a tram stop, and what we have here is the map showing that level of access. So this is all the residential areas where they are achieving this, so the darker the color the more likely you have this level of access, and in the outer suburban areas you see much lower, lighter colors and that's because they have less access to public transport.

Billie:And then we looked at what suburbs are actually achieving the policy, the policy was that 95% of houses should be in this level of access to public transport. And this is only where you really get everyone in the area. It's only in the inner city really that we find that most people have this level of access, so there's this gap between the policy, and who's actually within it. So there's inequities in terms of delivery of the policy.

Billie:We also found looking across the country, differing levels of policy ambition. So this is a really interesting one from Perth. Perth's policy is much more modest, it's policy is that 60% of dwellings, not like Melbourne 95%, should be within 400 meters of a bus stop, and public transport stop, and it looks pretty good, because this is the level of access. So this is the number of suburbs that actually meet that policy, 60% of dwellings meet that. So that looks kind of good right.

Billie:Look at Sydney, Sydney's policy is that 100% of dwellings should be within 400 meters of a bus stop, or 800 meters of a train stop, but there should be a service every 30 minutes. Much better policy, not very well [inaudible 00:37:06], 2% of suburbs have that access. So very interesting because what we argued in the report is actually it's better to have a better policy, and not be delivering, than the modest one, Perth's just sitting on its laurels thinking oh we're pretty good.

Billie:What we then did is we compared a common metric, which is our health related indicator, which is how many people live within 400 meters of a bus stop, which a service every 30 minutes. So we can compare apples to apples. And this is Perth, so here it looked really fabulous. This is the only suburbs where you've got most people at that level of access out of the inner city. Sydney has got many more areas where there's that level of access, nothing out in the west, but certainly close to the city, not doing too bad, in fact it's about 35-30%.

Billie:So, interesting differences comparing apples and apples was important. We did this across all the cities, so you see, it's actually only Sydney, Melbourne, and Adelaide, all have around 35% of people have that level of access. And in other places, Brisbane very poor, 12% of people meet that level of access, Perth not doing well, none of the other cities.

Billie:So quite interesting differences when you compare cities on a common metric. We also compared them on things like walkability, and you find the same, similar patterns, so inner city you're doing pretty well, same as in Perth, Brisbane, not too bad, all that in the fringe very bad of course, and all cities are the same. Sydney, not doing so well either. So what we're finding is that the policies are good at being delivered in the inner cities, but again this idea of inequity. And so if you're thinking about inequity in terms of the outer suburban areas, people can't walk anywhere, no public transport, it's quite an inequitable station.

Billie:We wanted to try and unpack that, why is that the case, and part of the reason is our policies, again we're doing policy analysis, is that the densities are so low. As our policies we actually build our cities at very low density, our policies for most Australian cities is on the fringe of cities, building at 15 units per head, which is very low. And even when we look at where is that policy which is very modest being delivered, you find it's really only in the inner cities that that's even being delivered. The places where it's walkable, the places where there's public transport, that's where we're getting, achieving, that low density 15 [inaudible 00:39:38].

Billie:We've got big problem with our policy ambition. When we looked at this, done by Lucy Gunn, and Claire Valaunch, Clair looked at what sort of levels of density do we need to encourage walking slightly and public transport use and to reduce driving, and we find that people are 2.5x more likely to walk 5.6x more likely to cycle, 3x more likely to use public transit, .5 are likely to drive, if we get up to 20-29 [inaudible 00:40:10].

Billie:So, density is really critical, and yet we're still building at such low densities on the fringe. I've emphasized in our livability index, a livable city has got to be a sustainable city, and we're certainly not doing well in that regard. This is the ecological footprint, this is work done by Pierre Newton. Looking at the ecological footprint along the bottom, and along the other axis, we're looking at the livability index, so this the [inaudible 00:40:39] intelligence unit. This is Melbourne and Sydney, so we're highly, highly livable. Really up, high score for livability, but really high ecological footprint.

Billie:And I've mentioned that we've just been knocked off by Vienna, it's got 1/2 the ecological footprint because of the way the city is designed, because of the public transport system, it fosters more cycling, and so a lot of the European cities, including London, Paris, I'm not sure in terms of ecological footprint than what we enjoy here in Australia.

Billie:So a big issue, so we have a way to go. There's many things that make a city livable, but we're not going to achieve the outcomes that we really desire because we have a long way to go. And we've recommended a number of things, we said that we need to have more evidence informed policy, that all the time creating more evidence we could be doing much better policy making if we used the evidence to form our policies.

Billie:We suggested that there needed to, we encouraged the idea of ambitious policy, I mentioned about Sydney it's public transit policy is very ambitious it's not being delivered, but we think go for ambition, and make short-term, and long-term targets to achieve it. Don't go for the Perth approach, 60% too low, I mean really that's not going to create an equitable city having such modest policies. Better to have ambitious policy, short and long term targets.

Billie:We've suggested that we really [inaudible 00:42:13] useful. Because then it tells us are the policies being delivered, and to whom are they being delivered to. We've suggested that the national cities performance framework be expanded to include broader indicators. A lot of our indicators have been picked up by the national performance framework for cities.

Billie:We've suggested there need to be better data standards, in particularly across our country, it's only a small country we could have consistent data standards that allow us to do these sorts of studies better and frequently, and we've suggested that these sort of cycles, creating these indicators, we should be checking in the same way we do the census, we should have an environmental census to see what policies are being delivered, who's getting them.

Billie:We've suggested that there needs to be better governors, methodological governors, that aligns local governments, state government, federal government, to be able to achieve the cities that we need in the 21st century. You can see these are really, they are multidisciplinary, no one really knows how to achieve these, and that's where the social scientists, the political scientists really need to be involved in this as well.

Billie:Just want to check with Xing about the time, how am I going?

Xing:5 minutes.

Billie:We have been thinking about this in terms of the sustainable development goals. Could city planning metrics help achieve the goals, and it's arguable, that really depends, and I'm just going to acknowledge, put a paper under here at the moment, Jonathon, [inaudible 00:43:49], and Melanie Lowe, what we were looking at, and I mentioned this is the framework we've got for our cities, and then what we have, I mentioned we need an integrated government because that's going to produce this intimations that will impact health.

Billie:And what I did was, we've gone through and done, we took the sustainable development goals, what's happened is that the UN has now approved a global indicator framework, with the idea to help achieve the goals, and what we did was map them against our framework, and what we found was, there's a lot of indicators, air pollution, personal safety, mental illness, these sorts of things. But not so much focused on the upstream, so how are we going to improve air pollution if we don't have any investments, and can't support, don't have any policies around air quality.

Billie:So, our concern is that what we're doing when we're setting up these frameworks is the indicators themselves won't do it unless we're asking the right indicators in there, and the indicators are a bit too downstream to achieve, there are some that are upstream, and there's a couple that have a focus on how much money is being spent, but there is no comparison for example on how much we're spending on transportation in different countries, and whether there's a transportation policy, or an air quality policy.

Billie:If you want to get better air quality, you need to have policies in place to achieve it. So we have some doubts, you might ask does this research, it's really applied research it's designed to have impact, and I just ant to talk you through and show you where some of our research has gone.

Billie:Our definition of livability is being adopted, and I'm pleased someone from the health department is here, Denise, it was adopted int eh health and well being plan 2015-2019, so that's quite important because local government looks to the state government health and well being plan to get clues about where it should be working at the local government to promote health. It's required to do this as well, plans, and this is where it gets clues about where to focus, so we're really pleased about that.

Billie:And its great because all of our livability indicators have been picked up in Cardinia, they just got a prize for the work that they're doing, its been picked up in the interface councils on urban fringe, its being picked up by Molland, where they talk about livable communities and refer to our work. The M[inaudible 00:46:20] Peninsula livability index have picked up our indicators into their framework, and there's also livability work being done here in the city of Melbourne.

Billie:In terms of the national level, federal level, our indicator they've picked a new indicator for transport, by the [inaudible 00:46:40], and in an actual performance [inaudible 00:46:44] for cities, and they even mention us as a source of it is from the creating livable cities report. They've also picked up our public owned space indicator, and they will next year put in our walkability indicator.

Billie:So design research that's tied to the policies that we're trying to influence, means that it's relevant to them and they're going to pick it up which is really a big thrill. We've been putting out our scorecards for cities, and this has created a lot of discussion, I've just been up in Brisbane last week for our final meeting about Center for Research Excellence, and Treasury because they're very interested in the work we've been doing. We've got a scorecard for Brisbane that've we've just put out.

Billie:So again, tying to their interests, the government's interests, it's much more likely to get picked up. So where are we going to next? We're working at the global level, we're just about to start doing global indicators with 20 cities across the globe. Hannah is doing work in Bangkok, [inaudible 00:47:43], she's got her own program work now, but she's doing work in Bangkok, looking at indicators, working with the city of Bangkok.

Billie:But we're working with a group of researchers in 20 cities where we're going to try to create indicators using geo-spacial data, to be able, and publish it in Lancet, as proof of concept is it possible to use data and to create a global network of data.

Billie:We're focusing on child development through attitude. So most of our work has been done with adults, but Karen [inaudible 00:48:15] she's been looking at child development and livability and what it's like for families in communities. But we're also doing work with [inaudible 00:48:23], not that that's that old in Brisbane.

Billie:Lucy Gaines is looking at thresholds, in terms of walking, but we're also looking at thresholds for green space. How much green space do we need to optimize our health, what's the size, what's the quality, that sort of area. Lucy Gaines is also looking at economics, we're trying to work out the economic evaluation, to be able to work out what makes it worthwhile from an economic perspective. We've certainly got some nice data on that.

Billie:Clair Valaunch is looking at using planning support tools to help planners to make better decision making when they're building their cities, and moving into [inaudible 00:49:10] less modeling. We're going to model the city which is really exciting, this is work led by Jonathon Arendale, and Claire Valaunch, and then we're also going to be testing out, this is Lucy, looking at the health impact in the cities that we make around autonomous vehicles.

Billie:There's been a model that's being developed by infrastructure Victoria, looking at different ways we could go with autonomous vehicles, we're going to look at the health impact of that, and then we can do the economic evaluation of the decisions that we make. And I think this is really critical, we need to be thinking upfront about our decisions before we just go off and do it and think oopsie, we've got a big expense here, and a big impact on the community.

Billie:The other area that we're not doing but Paul [inaudible 00:49:57] might, foreign PhD students, but we're thinking about the [inaudible 00:50:00]. We have policy and we don't implement it fully, the question is why. You know where is the leanage curve, so here's the policy principle, here's what ends up on the ground, but at each stage of the review process goes to local government, it goes back to the developers, it is reviewed by government, why doesn't it get delivered. This is what we call the leaking of the block pipe. We want to work out why this is a [inaudible 00:50:29] curve, and that's a really interesting question for us.

Billie:We're creating an urban observatory for our data, we want to give this back to the community so they can actually make a difference, and use the data. So if you [inaudible 00:50:40] on a computer, urban observatory in the making. We'll be opening next year, this is what it looks like. You'll be able to zoom in and go look at areas, and we'll give people metrics if an area is not looking very good they can go in and work out why.

Billie:Local government likes this because they can go in and work out in their area what they need to do to improve it. And of course, through the urban futures and capability platform we've been doing some work, we want to bring together evidence, and give it to governments, so we want to make a difference, and it's been terrific, we've been doing some policy briefs in time for the election, we've put it up on livability, active, transport, natural based solutions for sustainability surveys. [inaudible 00:51:26] but a whole bunch on transport that were done by the transport network, and we've done another on water, which is done by Julia in engineering.

Billie:And then there's another one on autonomous vehicles and new mobility, why it has to do that tying in engineering. So it's really, urban futures, we want to give out timely advice to government, which [inaudible 00:51:46] through policy has been leading this work, but this is the sort of thing we want to do. We want to have an impact.

Billie:So I'm going to stop there. [inaudible 00:51:57] so this is the why.

Billie:The why. Land use and transport policies have a major impact on [inaudible 00:52:03] and health. And there's lots of benefit from prioritizing livability, all these kinds of public transport, and really thinking carefully what's going to happen with autonomous vehicles, or electric vehicles.

Billie:No one solution is going to solve this, [inaudible 00:52:23], really needs to have teams of people working on them to solve them. And we've recommended a number of 8 integrative interventions and we need to be thinking about, ensure that we have a healthy and sustainable future, it does require integrative planning, across all the urban systems. And we think the [inaudible 00:52:43] indicators will help us sharpen our attention to see what are we delivering, who are delivering it to, and are we producing the sort of cities that will be healthy and sustainable into the future.

Billie:So thank you.

Xing:Thank you very much. We have a few minutes so now we open for questions if anybody has any.

Xing:I might just start. I look at what you are trying to do, lots of things, in Australia, and is that the cultural context for the whole thing. If you go to a different country, different culture, different religion, the regulatory framework is different. [inaudible 00:53:36] approach with [inaudible 00:53:37].

Billie:Well the research has been done like this. I mentioned that we're doing these indicators in other cities now. And it's been a big global study, 20 countries across the world have been collecting data, and we find that the same things are predicted. So the sorts of things that were in our model, are predictive, so the density, the access to transit, all those things, but the delivery of it might be different. So in some countries, for example, China or India, they've got plenty of density, but it's not safe to walk in India.

Billie:It's not a safe walking infrastructure, it's not safe at all for people to walk because of the amount of traffic, and there's not separation, so the principles are similar the delivery is different, so they need to be localized. So that's why you need to have a lot of interest in this in both India and China, and our Lancet paper, someone just translated it into Chinese, which we're very happy about, but there's a lot of interest in it. It just needs to be localized. The principles are the same, but the delivery will be different, and obviously the densities are very different.

Billie:So it's not a big issue to worry about density, it's about maybe some of the other things that need to be considered. And the other thing of course is the durability of the heat. I've just been up to Brisbane, and it's very hot there, and so you need to think about tree camping, and greening, to actually make it, and keep the heat affects down. So there's all these other things that need to be taken into account.

Billie:But we've sort of captured that I suppose in our concept of desirability, which is a bit of a catch all. So I think it requires contextualizing, but human behavior is the same, it just needs to be, the environments are different, they need to be contextualized.

Xing:Alright, any other questions, Margaret.

Margaret:I have a question about where does electricity play into all of this, and if we're talking about autonomous cars, and some of them being electric, then their pollution and their noise is much less, but there are other things that need to be taken into account. And in the public transport are buses considered, or is it just purely trains, and trams?

Billie:Buses are part of it yeah.

Margaret:Cause they're private, so when you talk about the distance of people to public transport, is that considering the bus routes that take them into the train lines that take them into...

Billie:Yeah. They've got terrible access to buses as well. That 400 meters out to a public transport, and those every 30 minutes. So their access is really poor around the fringe. But to make your point I think that's a really good one. That concerns me. I'd really like us to model moving to autonomous, or, it depends how they're going to be powered.

Margaret:Well I'm thinking electricity on buses that have solar panels on their roof or something that take the...

Billie:That would be great, but I worry that all these vehicles are going to use pop up [inaudible 00:57:06] car stations.

Margaret:Yeah.

Billie:That's not going to produce a good result.

Margaret:But solar panels.

Billie:Solar panels, yeah. Transitioning as quickly as possible to renewables, and when I think about the autonomous vehicle it could be a really great, if there were shared vehicles, and you know we have fewer vehicles, and we talk about that, there's lot of places in the world that live in a values free way of thinking about autonomous vehicles.

Billie:And are value streamlining so that everyone will just be able to do what they want, if we are going to get down to it, a bit of a nightmare, there will be drones, there will be autonomous vehicles. It could actually be bad, and we I think on our walks this is going to happen. And we have to ask ourselves the question, what is going to produce the best result for society, and we've got to bring together multidisciplinary teams to try and work out not only what's the best use of technology in a sustainable way, but the right energy, but also what's going to produce the best result for society that produces a good future.

Billie:And I think that's the beauty of what we're trying to do with ECPs is that we're coming at it not just within one system, or one discipline, but trying to bring a team together to produce...bringing in social science, bringing the political scientists, the people working with community, the people who talk to the community. Find out how to produce the best result, and that's where we've got a real opportunity.

Billie:I think we've got a responsibility to be honest, I've just written a book chapter for London School of Economics, and I think they're about to get away with it, but I did say in the end, that anyone who builds a city, should have to sign a hippocratic oath, first do no harm, and that's our responsibility. Yeah, just because we can doesn't mean we should, and if we are going to, what do we actually think about it upfront. We're smart enough we know the problems that have happened to the environment by us just being cavalier with technology.

Billie:Let's just now think about it and do it in a way that's going to produce the best result that optimizes the health impact or the world [inaudible 00:59:26], individuals and the environment, and minimalizes any harm.

Xing:Just one last.

Speaker 4:I'm interested in your [inaudible 00:59:38] drawing. Is that because culture, as you mentioned, or is it because of democracy, where blending is then changed in another 3 years time, and keeps on going on?

Speaker 4:So the example, I'm going to give is in Singapore, the first time I went there I was just a teenager, Melbourne has got the city look, and there's nothing at all in Singapore there's no transportation. And I just visited I think 5 years ago, and saw this public transport is fantastic over there. And I saw this headline in the NYT and it says within 2030 everybody will be living 5 minutes from a train station.

Speaker 4:We don't know how to do it, we don't have the budget, but we're going to do it.

Billie:It's easy to do things in Singapore because of the political system, there's no question about that. But it is an interesting point, I believe in [inaudible 01:00:56], it's interesting we did an evaluation on the state of policy in West Australia, and they have a policy it was only 47% implemented.

Billie:And we could actually look across all the different policies and see what was implemented and what wasn't. But the policy didn't work. The policy was fine, every chance of increase in the policy, the odds of people walking increase by 53%, sense of community improved by 22%, mental health by 11%, and being a victim of crime did increase by 40%. So the leaders were right, it was the implementation that was the problem, and that's why we're curious about the leaking pipe.

Billie:Is it when the different jurisdictions do their policies in different ways, but in West Australia, the state government, its responsibility was to review all of the plans. Now did they say, oh that's okay we're going to let that go, the lineage curve of that state, where they let things go that weren't right.

Billie:Or was it when it went back to local government that had to implement it? Was it them saying, oh we'll let that go. Or was it when the developer took it, and then just didn't develop what they were meant to deliver. So that's why it's interesting, but you're right in some jurisdictions we could have many more opportunities. That's the sort of conversations we need to have as a community. We do [inaudible 01:02:25] but also I think we need a relationship with the university as well.

Billie:The university has a responsibility to be thinking about this thing, and being [inaudible 01:02:35] and leaders, and saying, I really think, that in our university, what has to be seen is [inaudible 01:02:40] that we're not just putting things out there, but putting things that we're really important in that multidisciplinary view and we produce products, and policies, or technology that has really been thought through.

Billie:That is going to produce a good outcome. And we will get it wrong sometimes, I'm not saying that well be perfect, but it would be really nice if we were thinking about it. I think that's what the promise from the [inaudible 01:03:02] is about, is that it does provide people with those opportunities to look at things in a different way.

Billie:The other thing is we're putting in a big [inaudible 01:03:13] urban futures CRC, and what's great about that is the program I'm doing is about citizen centric solutions, actually asking the community, that's my area that I'm strong in.

Billie:But community engagement, how do we get the community engaged? The community is often wiser than we think, so I think we could be involved in the community and co-design the product, and actually gain their social license to put out products that both industry and government will have more confidence in. It's time to stop.

Xing:Just one last quick question.

Speaker 5:[inaudible 01:03:59]

Billie:It's very transparent. There's two types of indicators, one around policy and that was [inaudible 01:04:21] with the city, so Perth's policies, and that was the other thing every city has to give policies in Australia.

Billie:It's hard to imagine why they would do that, but we different policies in Perth, Melbourne, Sydney, and Brisbane. So we measure and reflected back to them what was being delivered, for every residential parcel in every capital city by the end of the year, we'll have them for the 21 cities that in the national performance framework. So the indicators are at the parcel level, so we can look at your home and say what do you have access to in terms of these things.

Billie:We haven't weighted them, and that's a very good point. We have created an index, but we didn't weight them. We sort of weighed them in a way because we uncapped some of the indicators, so we put in all the different types of destinations, which means it's weighted just because you've got more indicators in there. But that, if you're into those sorts of things, we would love to talk to you, we would love to try and do that.

Billie:So if you're a mathematician, come to our class, we'd love to work with you, that is something we'd love to be able to do. I think there's so much more work we could be doing with these sorts of things. The sky's the limit and without urban observatory were going to make it university wide, it's going to be for the community, but we're also creating a search platform so that people can come and work on those data sets. So if that's your thing that measurement. We'd love to talk to you.

Xing:Please join me to thank Billie for the excellent talk. All best for the new year.

Xing:Thank you.

Xinghuo Yu:My name is Xinghuo Yu. I'm the chair of RMIT Professorial Academy, which was just recently established by the Vice-Chancellor basically to give university an opportunity to have this kind of think tank to advise on university policies, to look at the features, and also to be ambassador to promote university.

Xinghuo Yu:Today is the one occasion, one the thing we do is really to celebrate some of the achievement of outstanding researchers, and also this lecture is another way is promote particular strong areas, and in particular is the impact for directions.

Xinghuo Yu:It give me a great pleasure today is to introduce distinguished Professor Min Gu, who is going to deliver the first inaugural RMIT Distinction Lecture. This is a great honor, but I don't want to read Min Gu's very long CV. Certainly he's one of the top researcher in the country or in the world as well in photonics.

Xinghuo Yu:He has many honors. As you know, that he is the fellow member of the Australian Academy of Science and Australian Academy with Technological Engineering and Science and also for member of the Chinese Academy of Engineering.

Xinghuo Yu:Today he's going to talk about Bio/Nanophotonics: Ready for Life and Work. I think this is going to be very easy to understand. I know there's concern about this, so sophisticated. Even all distinguished professor found it a bit hard, but I think Min is going to explain it very plain term, and particularly this is Friday, just to make sure that we do something entertaining. Without any delay, please join me to welcome Prof. Gu.

Prof. Min Gu:Thank you. Can you hear me? Okay. Thank you very much for coming to this inaugural lecture for RMIT Professorial Academy. I was very honored to be invited to give a first talk when Xing came to my office and say, "Well, you should give the first talk." I said, "Someone else should do it." I thank you very much for I'm pleased to come here to talk about very difficult topic, nanophotonics, and I'm trying to make it as simple as possible.

Prof. Min Gu:Now, whilst I was prepare this talk, I trying to minimize the mathematics. I know people hate mathematics, but eventually I found I have to include one mathematical formula. I'll hope you all enjoy that mathematical formula and why this is important for Ready for Life and Work. You will see mathematics. If you coming to say, "I don't want to see mathematics," close your eyes for this.

Prof. Min Gu:Let me first start that I would like to acknowledge the people of the Kulin Nations on whose unceded lands we are meeting today. I will respect if you acknowledge their elders' past and present for this particular occasion.

Prof. Min Gu:On this occasion, I also want to acknowledge that the support I have from my research group. It is this group, and they make me possible today I'm still speak whilst I'm still doing the ... and commit a lot of time in the administration roles in my RMIT. Thank you very much to those people in the audience and I really appreciate over the last three years the support.

Prof. Min Gu:I came to RMIT beginning at 2016. Thanks, RMIT, for the support. I had the lab opening at the end of 2016. You can see the photos. [Karin 00:04:05], you're there, and the Vice-Chancellor there. We had a lab open at the end of 2016, but we created a world-class facility in order to make this complicated nanophotonic device.

Prof. Min Gu:Having been in RMIT, it is important to aware that the Ready of Life is the strategy. Last year, we create a second laboratory, which is called the Photonics Technology Translation Facility. What I'll talk about today, most of the work has come from the second lab, but it's very important to have the first lab in order to produce the excellence. Then we can translate into the impact of what we talk about.

Prof. Min Gu:Now, let me first start to say, what is the photonics? In fact, the photonics is the science of light. We have light in the room, and that's the photonics. That's very easy. Now, how important the photonics. Two or three weeks ago, there was a Prime Minister Award. If you look at the award, the most important award, the Prime Minister Award Prize for Innovation.

Prof. Min Gu:This year, this prize awarded to these four gentlemen. If you look that what they have done for this country, switching light for fast and more reliable internet. It's very important to realize, when we talk about the light, immediately is related to the life we are living, and it's also the concept immediately coming to the mind the internet.

Prof. Min Gu:These four gentlemen, what they have done is, if we think about what we learned in high school, Newton's Prism. If we want to resolve the sunlight into multiple color, seven colors, so we learned in high school, but what they say is they can resolve into 100 colors. Color is very important.

Prof. Min Gu:What that means, they can actually send these multiple colors through this optic fiber. That's where link everywhere from the city, Melbourne, from the internet, from the data center, to the homes. It is important, notice this fiber is now enabling our everyday life, but it's also we should actually acknowledge that the person who invented the fiber is actually receive the Nobel Prize in 2010 as the physics. They can see how mathematics and physics important. He passed away, unfortunately, last year.

Prof. Min Gu:That is light, internet, fast, reliable. That's the way how this important for these four gentlemen. In fact, one of the people, Steven, actually helped RMIT to evaluate some of RMIT's technology in these areas as entrepreneur.

Prof. Min Gu:Now, I just touch base that color is important. More color, more information, more movie, more data you can do, and faster. Now, there is a limit. That's why we have a bandwidth, broadband network. Bandwidth means how many colors you can do.

Prof. Min Gu:Apparently you can say, "Why don't we increase the color? Thousands of color?" Unfortunately, we do not have this capacity. There is a limit. How many colors we can send through the fiber, limited by the material, limited by the capability how many we can produce the color.

Prof. Min Gu:There is one things over the last few years. These things. This is actually invented about four, five years ago. You can see it's twisting. Twisting, it means a very important, another equivalent color. You can think about color, but it's not called color. It is actually call the angular momentum. It is angular momentum that increase the additional capacity.

Prof. Min Gu:This would be another revolution in telecommunication, but the issue is, how can we put this twisting, which is called the optic angular momentum, into the fiber? Now what RMIT's contribution 2016 is we know the group from Boston, they can put this twisting, which is angular momentum, into the fibers. That means that we now extend the bandwidth, but the question here is, can you use that twisting to carry the information?

Prof. Min Gu:What we did is say, "Well, yes, we can actually now coding the information into this kind of twisting light through the fiber." That's important to prove that concept. It's very fundamental science concept, but the next question is, can we detect it? Can we see it?

Prof. Min Gu:Now if you can transmit we cannot see, then, this useless. This is why recently over the last few days there's another round of media RMIT released that we have detector, we play the detector. How small the detector? Like a human hair. We can actually reduce traditionally to detect this kind of light from the tabletop, dining table, to now the human hair size. That is very important, another step as we are now we achieve this year.

Prof. Min Gu:Now where this go? What this eventually give to the Life and the Work, what this go? This is the future. Li-Fi. If you haven't heard that, this emerging technology is coming. What that means is that everything you see here, the light in this room, eventually becomes the Wi-Fi.

Prof. Min Gu:To do that, we need significantly extended bandwidth. Color is not enough. We need a different means. Anything related to physically you can actually design to this information, they are important. Angular momentum is emerging as very important. In fact, this project is being fund by the ARC Discovery Grant this year, start from this year.

Prof. Min Gu:I'm not talking this. I'm going to stop here, change to more general: the impact of the light. Now I talk about this impact and introduce that the light is very important related to internet, but in fact, if you look at the light, they're all related to more broader topic. They're related to telecommunications, solar energy, sensing, autonomous car, AR/VR, brain science, big data.

Prof. Min Gu:I will talk about in the next rest of the talk to cover these three topics we are working in RMIT. At the end of these three topic, I will point to the why this is important to brain science and how this artificial intelligence coming into the picture for all this journey we are doing.

Prof. Min Gu:Big data. I don't need to emphasize how important. It's not because engineering science. It is now very important to any aspect in social science, in the humanity, and in any other research area, but if I start asking where the data is, how much the data, and I do want to go to that, as I said. Let's look at the chart.

Prof. Min Gu:This is basically we are saying, every second year, we double it. This looks not difficult, but if you start calculating this every second year doubled, it's a huge number this what we are facing. This is the way the problems. What is more problem is, every country contribute to this, and I was trying contribute roughly 4.5% of the data.

Prof. Min Gu:For any developed economy, roughly similar to order of magnitude of 4% or 5% to the global data, but the problem is that we produce so much data, only 70%, the 70% of data cannot be stored. We don't have a space. We talk about cloud, the way as a cloud. Cloud is physically is a house you have to store somewhere in the device. Only 70% of the data can be currently stored.

Prof. Min Gu:Also, among the stored data, there is another issues. 70% of data stored, you not use it. It's called the cold data. You don't use it. For some reason, maybe two years, three year, maybe 10 years, they are useful. They have to keep it here. That's where the current problem I was talk about what's the problem.

Prof. Min Gu:We have cloud. Cloud is a house inside a house lots and lots and lots of device. Then they take the energy away. How much energy? 3%, 4% of the national and electricity use. It's huge. When you think about the data center, it cost 3% or 4%. That's a huge energy consumption. I'll come back to this.

Prof. Min Gu:There's also environment. These are huge data centers like football stadium. Lots of material, lots of infrastructure you have to committed to that. This is not environment-friendly and there's a lot of cables material you have to also to consume.

Prof. Min Gu:One of the problem is the longevity, because the current device that you go to data center, they will tell you every two to three years or every three to five years, depending on what media they use, you have to change that. You can see, if you change the recording media how much energy you needed to consume, you do this complete again. Think about that. Every three to five years, this is our problem.

Prof. Min Gu:The energy consumption is a problem. How do we compare this energy consumption? This is the data as talk about say, if you believe now every second year data is double that. Now this is the oil, petroleum. If you turn all the annual yield of oil into the electricity, then you will see that this is the electricity needed to store all the data.

Prof. Min Gu:There will be very soon, in 10 years' time, there will be a problem that you don't have enough petroleum if you turn all the petroleum into electricity. This is really the problem. That's all the big data center they are facing, that whilst we are promote digital economy, big data, there is the pressing issues, how do we make this sustainable?

Prof. Min Gu:This, as I said, if you take analogy 2011 or if you store all string data, that means that consuming the whole national electricity consumption. That's the type of the issues we are facing. How do we solve the problem?

Prof. Min Gu:I go back to the optics now. Let me go back to the equation I want to show you. First of all, if you go to Jena, you see the memoriam in the downtown city park. See how important to remember this gentleman's called Ernst Abbe. If you look that Abbe, what they put under monument.

Prof. Min Gu:This is interesting to see that equation. That is the discover. Very simple. What that means, it means that if you go send a light through the lens, the lens, we all use the lens. It's piece of lens. What that lens for, to see small detail. How small the detail you can see? That is the formula tells you what is the smallest feature you can see through the lens.

Prof. Min Gu:Now I just rewrite this formula slightly different. This is the modern way to write. This is engraved on the memoriam. This is important. Now if he didn't pass away before the first Nobel Prize award, and he would be the first person win the Nobel Prize. You see how important, why this is important, because this is lay the foundation the microscope. The microscope are now we are still using after hundred years, still this is enabling because of that simple formula.

Prof. Min Gu:Another German scientist, Maria Goeppert. In her PhD, she discovered that so-called two-photon citation. Now forget about it. Just remember the name. What that means? If you combine with the microscope with this kind of discovery, and you will see that these are difference.

Prof. Min Gu:If you take Maria's discovery seeing through the microscope, you will see a tiny dot, but if you don't, then you see a blurred thing. Now this is important. How important? Very simple. I'll you example. Opera House. We build Opera House seven years, using seven years.

Prof. Min Gu:This, we build up a mini opera house, 30 minutes. That is the foundation of nanotechnology. Nanofabrication now. 3D fabrication can go to the nanoscale. It is because of that discovery. She was awarded the Nobel Prize in 1963. How small this, the Australian kangaroo? We actually fabricated this. The background of this is the human hair.

Prof. Min Gu:Another thing so I want to introduce with optics. Let's now go to the optic disk to touch the topic. The optic disk is invented after almost 100 years of Ernst Abbe by this American entrepreneur. What he says, "Okay, that's good, so let's think about this formula."

Prof. Min Gu:What that means, it gives you smallest the feature you can see. What happen if I use this smallest feature? Burn a mark on the disk. That is the CD burner. That's the concept from very simple turn the imaging, see through to the burning. We burn the mark. That's where using this formula.

Prof. Min Gu:That means we can see, we can burn a very, very small dot on the disk. That's where the first concept, the first-generation CD, based on this concept. The industry, you can see, if you remember 20 years, 30 years ago, CD was really the place lots of things in every aspect.

Prof. Min Gu:Then we went to this Blu-ray. Now what is the Blu-ray? Basically make the, see whether we can work around that formula make it a little bit smaller. You can actually think about that make this more clever not using one layer, you can do this multiple layer.

Prof. Min Gu:The capacity, smallest feature. Remember, this is smallest feature you can put it in, and that means roughly 300 gigabyte. That will be our maximum. That was the reason DVD now not being popular, because the good things become better things under the current situation.

Prof. Min Gu:2005, at that time, we proposed a concept. Thanks to ARC after accept that concept, we got the ARC Discovery Grant, and we call this five-dimension data storage. Whether you can see that we actually break that ceiling, so the bottleneck issues, 300 gigabytes, we now can do terabytes, 10 times more than information you can put it in.

Prof. Min Gu:Now this marked beginning of the nanophotonics. Very important, the nanophotonics. What we do in this case is using this tiny nanoparticles, now it's very popular, this kind of nanoparticle is the metal particle. We use gold because gold is just available at that time. You can use other material.

Prof. Min Gu:They are not sphere. They elongate. Why they elongate? Because if I have a sphere turn around in the space, you will not see you turned. You don't identify the difference, but if I have lost, if I turn around, you will see you turn around. That means the equivalent of the color.

Prof. Min Gu:It's exactly the same thing as want to see multiple difference, then I can put the information into that. We use this different orientation, you can detect and we can actually achieve the optic data storage. This is over the years quickly snatched up, along that journey, first concept published in 2009. In fact, the work started 2005.

Prof. Min Gu:Over the years, we proved that this kind of a storage is secure and could be ultra-secure because you have amount of information. Then, we also, 2017, we can reduce. Remember, energy consumption is the issues. We reduce the consumption per bit, each bit, and to a very small value.

Prof. Min Gu:Now if you couldn't imagine how small this value is, this is equivalent to the brain consume energy. We want to eventually go to that region, because our body is actually the best efficient can use the energy. We do not consume too much energy in the brain.

Prof. Min Gu:Another things we achieve the last year is we can now store the information up to 650 years. 650 years. Think about that. Someone will argue, why I need? I will show you why we need these things, and for the long data storage, but I also list here a couple of things. This is for this Ready for Life and Work.

Prof. Min Gu:First things, we submit the patent in 2013. Two years later, we submit another patent. This year, we also submit the patent on this one. I'll talk about this while we needed these three patents. Go back to this formula. Now remember that this is the Ernst Abbe engraved on the monument.

Prof. Min Gu:This is this gentleman and he was awarded Nobel Prize 2015 for Chemistry. Not for Physics, for Chemistry. Now if you look at that, what is it he discover? He discover this formula. How close these two formula? The only additional things here is little. What that means? Why this got a Nobel Prize?

Prof. Min Gu:Now remember, these are still the smallest of feature that becomes better things. Better is in the biology, you cannot see inside the cell because you have to go into the cell, have a look at what cancer or cancer. You also want to see nanoparticles, small, very small. You can't do it using optical microscope.

Prof. Min Gu:What this gentleman says is, well, how about I do these things? When you see small things, using eraser to erase this fluorescence along the age of that small spot, very simple thinking. He invented this idea when he was a post-doc.

Prof. Min Gu:Now if you look at this picture carefully, had you recognized that's Australian? Phillip Island. He was in my lab when I was at Victoria University in 1997 and he was a post-doc. He created this idea. Now did everybody think he's crazy. How can you do that, achieve this kind of an action? He did.

Prof. Min Gu:Now of course if I simply say, because that formula, he got a Nobel Prize. No impact to Karin. There we have the impact. Formula. That's impact. For 15 years, everybody criticized. He actually worked with industry. Leica, the big microscope company developed this instrument. This will cost a half-million. If you buy a microscope for this one, it will be half a million.

Prof. Min Gu:Everywhere in biology that you go to, Melbourne University, any biologic lab, they will buy this microscope. It's called a STED microscope. It's how important the concept and turning into the product, and also how long the journey, 15 years, that he actually get this.

Prof. Min Gu:I'll come back to this formula now. He invented this. Also, because of that formula, smallest feature you can do, this becomes now the bottleneck issue of the Blu-ray. We think in same way. Along the 2010, we will say, "Well, why don't we do this thing?" We erase it. You record, we erased along the age, and we do it continual. Then we also turn that formula into slightly complicated formula, but we achieve that using this geometry, the method that we call "spin." He goes there and we call spin.

Prof. Min Gu:What that means? Of course in the laboratory, you have to do very complicated. These are the system we can achieve now, 33 nanometer. In fact, the smallest the feature is 9 nanometer. Now for those people who working in the nanotechnology, you know smallest the feature, the electro-microscope where you can see, you can give is along the 7 or 10 nanometer. This is optic method, gives you the smallest feature, 9 nanometer. This is actually achieved in a much cheaper format.

Prof. Min Gu:That is actually the times we realize this can change the data storage industry, we call the new era is coming, so which means using this 33 nanometer, we can actually better the capacity up to 340 terabytes, so thousand times high than the bottleneck issues in the Blu-ray, and this much better than the traditional in terms energy consumption, in terms environmental protection.

Prof. Min Gu:This is over the years we work on this journey. Now if you put this into this comparison, hard disk, fresh memory of the disk. The hard disk eventually reach the ceiling because the nanotechnology and because all this industry can do, so there's a ceiling going towards ...

Prof. Min Gu:You can actually do possible in few years' time the nanotechnology, nanofabrication becomes better, but still you can see there is a ceiling we can achieve for this hard disk industry. Then, optics, because of that formula, stops somewhere here. Now, with this technology, spin technology, we can assess to the nanoscale and we are actually going on this another disruptive change.

Prof. Min Gu:Long data storage. Remember that the 650 years, that is very important, the milestone we achieve at RMIT. Why we needed that? There are a number of area really need a long data storage. Brain research. Brain research, you record the conscious or the thinking, you need a long data storage. You need a high-capacity data storage and long time.

Prof. Min Gu:The other one is the telescope we are developing, Australians also part of the project, square kilometer array telescope. Large amount of data that is only meaningful if the 100 years long this kind of data. Then, there's a gravitation wave and an even longer time scale for this meaningful result.

Prof. Min Gu:In fact, recently, as I said, there's a more related to the other area, geology, biology, astronomy, history, they all need long data. You need it to data meaningful over the few generations. This is actually the reality how we want to do from their own words.

Prof. Min Gu:[Inaudible 00:28:17]. Large amount of data consume energy. We need to consume much less, so our ambitions through the ARC project, the Discovery one, the first one I got when I came to RMIT, we want to go into femtojoule. If you look at 2017, we achieve picojoule. We want another three order magnitude the reduction of the consumption. We were using nanotechnology. I'll come back to this one.

Prof. Min Gu:Next one, longer. Longer and higher capacity. That's the demand from industry. We are actually working on combination, the spin technology and the nanotechnology. Then faster. If you have a vast amount of information, we want fast. How do we do that? We want to have, again, the high capacity, and we need artificial intelligence. That's the way.

Prof. Min Gu:Let me give some flavor what we are now achieve along this direction. The first one, student. One of the student, Simon, I hope he's in the audience. He came from Italy. We just launched the patent. What we use is using very low-cost material. It's called the [inaudible 00:29:29] nanoparticle. These are the crystal.

Prof. Min Gu:We collaborate with Singapore National University and we achieve what he did and say, well, using this nano-crystal, we can now moving into the region where the consumption of energy can be reduced another three order magnitude, and also, nanotechnology. This is the patent we just submitted. He just show some success result there, and hopefully another six months he will conclude this piece of the work.

Prof. Min Gu:Then, artificial intelligence. We will do it, but I don't believe ... I won't do it. I do not have time to do these things, but we have to work on this complicated artificial neural network. This is the concept of how do you make things faster.

Prof. Min Gu:This is the calculation method. How do you calculate this multiple, the focus port, and through this artificial neural network things? That's too complicated. I can't do it. What I can do is we facilitate a workshop with the Computer Science people, computer scientists in the School of Science.

Prof. Min Gu:This is one of the workshop we facilitate. You see Sheldon Lee, [inaudible 00:30:41], they all are very enthusiastic. Very important we are now have a paper on my desk to submit through this workshop, and it will be submitted to a very important journal through this collaboration.

Prof. Min Gu:We are actually trying to, through this conceptual development to the device, which is on the 13 floor, the translation lab, and turning into we call a box. Of course, industry needed to be onboard, and hopefully this can be go into this one.

Prof. Min Gu:Now, that's what we can see what's the future happening. With this Blu-ray technology, the people are producing now the optical media and data center for the reason that low energy consumption, but the size for this amount of information, 100 petabyte space capacity, we need roughly 300-meter-square space, but if we do our own, then we only need a one meter to achieve equivalent things.

Prof. Min Gu:This is the huge impact, of course, and the most important with this optic technology. Then you can see that the energy consumption can be much, much lower. I think we did the calculation few years ago, if we do the solar cell power of the building that is electricity we can generate, a solar panel can be used to power all this optic disk. This will be now beyond the force field. You can use energy outside earth to do the big data.

Prof. Min Gu:I won't be able to deliver this. The industry collaboration, as we can see, very important. The first things, as I said, around 2013, when we have the technology, this spin technology, this company is a spinoff company from Facebook staff member. They actually called me when I was in Singapore. They said, "Well, have you thought about this spin technology for application?" I said, "Well, it's fun. We published a paper." "Nice."

Prof. Min Gu:They actually came to [inaudible 00:32:52] to the patent for optic data storage. They just send the [inaudible 00:32:58] to the patent. Of course they wanted the patent licensed to OAI. A year later, the technology was bought by Sony. Sony acquired OAI.

Prof. Min Gu:About that time, we launched the second patent which is the long data storage idea, and this eventually, there's another company from China, they licensed before I left, actually, [inaudible 00:33:21] this license to another company in China.

Prof. Min Gu:Very interesting, when we publish the result, the 650 years, early this year, Microsoft actually approached us from Microsoft Cambridge and they want to know what we do with 650 years. Now, this is very important. I mentioned it. Sometimes we thought that this is the pathway. We do, but in fact, when I went there, everything I telling you, this possible or not possible.

Prof. Min Gu:Maybe this is not the industry want to go to the pathway. Why is that? When we go to the cloud, so the data center, they manage multiple data center around the world, and they not consider individual disk performance. If you improve individual disk performance, that not necessarily the best of pathway for the cloud storage.

Prof. Min Gu:In fact, they are working on this, a similar competing technology from University of Southampton in UK. They work on this concept, optic cloud. Because ND, I can't go to the detail, but this is actually the future and we've been invited to present a pitch to this concept, how do we eventually all the technology we develop can be used on cloud. This is the way optic data storage.

Prof. Min Gu:I want to quickly change the gear to another technology which is very important, again, invented by Dennis Gabor. Dennis Gabor invented this so-called holography. For that, he actually got a Nobel Prize in 1971. He was born in Hungary, eventually later living in UK, I think Cambridge or Oxford.

Prof. Min Gu:Now, this is his invention. Now I don't want to go into this detail, what that holography means, but I think that you have the experience that if you go to some of the museum, and they have nice this hologram, a 3D picture. It can be through 3D, but what is ultimately this technology can be impact is from this movie.

Prof. Min Gu:Have you see this movie? You saw this, 3D movie, the first 3D movie, Avatar. That's the movie. This actually show that the future, the 3D display, it should be like that. Important I want to emphasize, this person watch this 3D side view, not in the way we watch normally. This is important. The signal you will receive, your side. You're not face it. This, how to achieve, holography can do that.

Prof. Min Gu:Now, at this stage, this is the device. It's called a spatial light modulate, SLM. This is actually a piece of device currently used for generate this kind of a hologram. If you start to do a little bit analysis why this doesn't work, and if you look that SLM versus if you look at this viewing angle, I emphasize this viewing angle is important, if you want to do 3D, you have to be able to see, this is the screen and you can see somewhere here. The viewing angle becomes very important.

Prof. Min Gu:SLM can only give a few degrees. A few degrees. That's why we want to now design all these things we have to face it. You cannot achieve really 3D. In order to break this ceiling, then you needed to think about what's the problem? The problem is that we have to now moving from this region to the region more than 90 degrees.

Prof. Min Gu:You can see that the size predicted that it's very challenging, but this is actually we achieve a few years ago. We can use this laser printing in graphing. This is a graphing material. It's very popular, but we use the laser to produce this hologram, simply speaking.

Prof. Min Gu:What this advantage in this technology is we actually put multiple color. If you can put three color, it means that all these true color imaging you can achieve that. We achieved 52 degree. This is 52 degree, 52 degree in this technology. Now, going beyond that, I'll tell you why this is difficult. Let's first have a look at one of the movie which, at that time when we published result, it was list on the Time Magazine in the front page.

Prof. Min Gu:This is actually the movie. You can see, this test object three-dimension, you can see from minus-26 degree to positive-26 degree, around this, so 52 degree, you can see this. This is the first time. I guarantee that this is the real 3D, the imaging. You can see the wide angle.

Prof. Min Gu:The one step, the one step to reach that level. That is because the technology. Again, go back to why we cannot do that, because Ernst Abbe said, "The smallest the feature, there's a limit." You can't do more than that. You can't go more than this.

Prof. Min Gu:We will continue on. Last year, and this is another paper we published. The one step, we do step by step. We actually can produce a hologram and in very, very thin sheets. There is housing 1,000 hair size. It's very, very thin. That means you can extend this into the more broad application. One is this vision. This is really a number of industry now want us to demonstrate that with this kind of watching, and then you can actually achieve is a 3D display.

Prof. Min Gu:To do that, the first things, we needed to increase the viewing angle. The viewing angle, as I said, with the spin now, we should be able to achieve 90 degree. Now I do have the result, but I didn't have time to include. In fact, last week, one of the post-doctor achieved that this smallest feature would really go beyond other limit. This is doable. We want to also do flexible, and I'll show you the flexibility in a minute.

Prof. Min Gu:The next thing, so must be dynamic. If we don't do dynamic things, you can't see the movie, all these thing. For that, we launched the patent this year to make sure that the idea, before we can talk, the idea is being patented. Very soon, we will be able to now solve this problem. As I said, we want to go to the smallest feature and go to our mobile unit.

Prof. Min Gu:Just as one demonstration, you can see, this is the flexible material and we can actually produce a hologram into this material. Of course, at this stage it's still not high-quality, but it demonstrated that this 3D holographic imaging can be build up into this flexible structure, and this is the pathway is there.

Prof. Min Gu:Last topic. Super capacity. Karin. This is Karin's favorite topic. What I will only emphasize what the contribution, what we have contributed to this field. Now, what is a super capacity? There's a academic definition of "super" and there's also very easy to understand the "super." "Super," it means that quick charge, and you can have charge this capacity very quickly. You don't need to wait for hours to get the charging. That's super.

Prof. Min Gu:You can actually reuse, charge and recharge and recharge much more times than the current battery, and again, this is super. There is the possibility you can actually make this into flexible, and that means that all the stretchable device, flexible device we dreamed, this can be powered by this kind of a device. They are environmentally friendly, so it's much less damage to the community, to the environment.

Prof. Min Gu:There are the scientific definitions, "super," and this is probably from more layman point of view. I go back to the scientific comparison, do this easy one first. This is a very simple comparison. Notice, kind of also have similar slides on that.

Prof. Min Gu:Super capacity versus lithium-ion battery. This is the one we use in mobile phone similarly, so all this in mobile phone. We experience the problem, the safety issue, there's a chemical problem issues, all kind of issue, but this let's compares very important.

Prof. Min Gu:As I said, the charge cycle much better than the traditional one, and there's also the fast, fast charging. This is the very fast charging and lifetime longer, but there is one problem. The problem is energy density. Why is this so good? Why not we use it? Because we cannot put too much energy into this one. There is a problem. This is where you can see this currently the very low energy density if you want to do have a lift, you have to use many, many of these things in order to achieve the practical application.

Prof. Min Gu:Go to young people. We have [Litty 00:42:54]. Litty is in the audience? Not? This is another PhD student. She just finished the PhD last year. Now, this is her idea, independently proposed. It's not my idea. I just endorsed the idea. This is a good idea.

Prof. Min Gu:We were working these issues, how do we put the more electricity into this super capacity? Now what she come back the idea, say, "Why don't we learn from this tree?" Tree, the particular tree is called a fern tree. If you look at the tree, it's American fern tree, and under the microscope, then you see this very nice pattern.

Prof. Min Gu:This side under the ... close to the macro-nanoscale. They're the interesting things what she discovered. This pattern mathematically, let's go to the math, mathematically, it's equivalent to this fractal structure. Hubbard is very famous mathematician. He actually predict a lot of things. They're the pattern Hubbard fractal. They are equivalent, mathematically exact, the same.

Prof. Min Gu:Why we need this equivalence proof? Because now, this pattern, I can ask the laser to follow the trajectory. The laser can follow this pattern to produce electron which can store the energy. Now more than that, this pattern, actually the fractal is a cell for reproduce.

Prof. Min Gu:When you go to smaller, produce this same pattern, when you go to smaller codes in the pattern. We can actually really control at a nanoscale the size. This can be also done on the substrate. This actually fabricate a structure, and this on the substrate, flexible substrate.

Prof. Min Gu:She done very more since integrated this device on the solar cell panel. This on the top, there's a solar panel, and under that, there's super capacity. It's actually one girl you can actually make using this technology to finish this using layer-by-layer fabrication to achieve that.

Prof. Min Gu:That's Litty's PhD. She also actually done that increase the size moving to the slightly larger than the research size. This is another product that she produced in her PhD. At that time, the energy density is higher, it's higher than the published result, but it's not high than what we want to go. Litty's result received mainly inquiry from the industry even from Defense. For that, we'll launch the patent in March this year. Litty was awarded this RMIT Impact Award for HDR Student.

Prof. Min Gu:From there onwards, now on this journey, so first of all, using spin, we want to increase to this number. This will be equivalent to lithium-ion battery. Then we want to size the increase with this ceiling funding, and then we are actually also integrated with the solar cell for the panel for the design harbor. This is Litty. Just yesterday, she told me she can actually achieve this fractal pattern on the fabricates. This is the conductive fabrics and this can be done.

Prof. Min Gu:This is the movie, I quickly show that, so that we can generate electricity from solar panel and then charge the super capacity. This is charging and this is super capacity. These, the fan, you will see that after minutes charging, so after charging ... Come on.

Prof. Min Gu:After the charging to the one volts and we turn off the solar cell, so disconnected this part and store the energy here, and then turn on the loading, the fan is there, so the electricity. We will scale up using this device to achieve this work with ...

Prof. Min Gu:Now, I want to wrap up my talk and just touch this topic. We all talk about artificial intelligence. Now, maybe the next few slides, my view will be very provocative. It's my personal view. This is where the direction to go. We all talk about artificial intelligence. I call this is the Phase 1. Based on this very simple older technology, still older, computer separated memory and calculation, but still like that, we still work on this architecture.

Prof. Min Gu:The only thing is this person, Turing, is very famous. He said we can do, using computer, do some testing. The human task make this so-called artificial intelligence. We can beat the game in the chess and this is the goal, our goal.

Prof. Min Gu:Everything we develop, this is all based on one's principle. It will not actually revolution. What is the revolution? It will be these things. The computer were based on the neural network. The chip will do the neural doing the job.

Prof. Min Gu:What that means, the neural will eventually collect a signal, do the calculation, pass on the signal, all and go within one cell. We have a millions, millions of the cell, and then it will make a decision. This is called the neuromorphic computing.

Prof. Min Gu:Now if the neuromorphic computing can be developed, this is really artificial intelligent, the computer. Now, by putting this biological model into the engineering model, and what that means is that we need as a device, you can calculate the waiting, the waiting from [inaudible 00:49:17]. We have to have a waiting like this one. Then we do this decision and then pass on, and on and on again. They produce this synapsis type of function and do this calculation. These are the two major functions, and it must be combined together.

Prof. Min Gu:This is over the few years, last few years, a very hot topic around the world. Again you can see this from Alan Turing and the same guys propose this artificial intelligence, the concept, the Turing test, he also proposed this concept so-called this neuromorphic computing. Then, this is the first person to use traditional computer to achieve this concept. It's huge, but you will not go into it because energy consumption issues, it's a huge energy consumption.

Prof. Min Gu:This is where the integrator circuit come into the picture, and that's where the magnet is smaller. Recently, now you can see photonics, RMIT, Princeton last year simultaneous published a paper going to neuromorphic photonic chip. Why that already emphasize photon carry much less energy, consume much less energy.

Prof. Min Gu:If you look at their result, what they are missing? They do this based on this calculation, and that's were achieve. The blue color means this based on the basically equivalent to [inaudible 00:50:43] communication type of a device, but they're missing this part. They do not have a synapsis.

Prof. Min Gu:While they do the synapsis calculation and the probability calculation, they still use traditional computer. It's not really neuromorphic things. What we recently proposed that the RMIT, the concept that we haven't going to the patent. If any in the audience, don't worry, I didn't disclose too much here.

Prof. Min Gu:We have a concept and I can see with joule here, by one of the early [inaudible 00:51:16] research, and through this device, we should be able to now produce this function. If we produce this function, connect it with this, and then, this will be really complete, the photonics or photonics neuromorphic computing with speed of light.

Prof. Min Gu:Now, I'm not trying to say, well, this is the only my view, it's happening in RMIT, in Princeton, in Stanford. In fact, the recent paper published University of California, they actually also moving onto this direction. It's publishing science, actually. It will happen, or optic computing with the speed of light with this kind of concept.

Prof. Min Gu:Just to finish up, this neuromorphic computing, if you use in traditional way, the first one, the energy consumption per signal pathway is somewhere here. Then using this electronic one, you'll reduce two to three order magnitude.

Prof. Min Gu:The real neuron is sitting here. There's six order magnitude that we have to find for, and then the photonics can come into this picture. Again, spin becomes very important in this case. The size, the energy consumption, that is the way we are targeting in this region.

Prof. Min Gu:Just want to summarize that I actually trying to say mathematics, science, they are very important, and this is the way we do lots of fundamental work, but in the meantime, we very well aware that the impacted is in each of the area. I didn't have time today talk about the house area. We do a little bit of work actually in this area, but I want to emphasize last, the one that all the work now point us into this, the real neuromorphical artificial intelligence, one I want to ... the group is eventually to move in this area.

Prof. Min Gu:Of course, industry is very important to take this all the result. These are all the industry, after RMIT, there's a number of industry coming to approach us, and specifically for the three technology, the optical data storage, the holographic, and the graphing super capacity.

Prof. Min Gu:I'll stop here. Thank you very much for the attention.

Xinghuo Yu:Thank you very much, Min, for the excellent talk. Now we have time for a few questions. Anybody have any questions, comments? Yes. I'm not sure if this one is working or not, but you can try. Otherwise, just shout. I think it's working.

Speaker 3:Thank you, Min. That was a fantastic talk. Fascinating. One of our question is, I'm particularly interested in the AI structure you mentioned. If you use the photonic technology, is the computer or the neuron will be binary or is it going to be like a decimal or even different type of representation maybe, analog?

Prof. Min Gu:Yes. It could be combination. It could be digital, it could be analog, and could be the combination, either digital or analog. In fact, you probably realize that another branch towards this neuromorphic computing is memories. If you look at the design in memory computing, and there are two ways still, but personally I believe that the digital probably is more advantage in terms of the signal and coding, and from our point of view.

Speaker 3:When you form the structure, can the structure be changed later on?

Prof. Min Gu:Oh, you have to design according to the ... Probably it's difficult. I think it will be related to here. Different approach probably need a different architecture.

Speaker 3:Thank you.

Xinghuo Yu:Thank you very much. Any other comments, questions?

Speaker 4:Thank you for the fantastic talk. Just a quick question. Can you comment on what you pointed out just now about neuromorphic computing? There's another quantum computing. Can you comment on any connections or any opportunities to different ideas or different concepts?

Prof. Min Gu:The quantum computing is actually still based on the current architecture thinking. You just increase the more states. If you do the job zero-one, the current computing, the quantum computing say, "Well, I can do zero-many, many states." It's not from zero-one. You can have a one. Quantum is a probability, so it actually could be unlimited, the states. Then, so that you can do the calculation much faster. That is from that angle.

Prof. Min Gu:Now, one of the problems I see, the energy consumption. Because you're still going on the traditional technology, silicon technology, all the technology, and you have to do the hardware to achieve this kind of things, the energy consumption possibly will be one of the problem.

Prof. Min Gu:Going to neuromorphic computing, because I have limited time, one of the important things, so this will combine into one unit. The calculation memory will be in one unit, and that will be the way to reduce the consumption. Now I also need to emphasize that, ultimately, we will not go through, I believe this eventually scientists who are not going to this way. This is still the concept [inaudible 00:57:17] this separately, but the way that one of the ... In fact, I was involved one of center of excellence UI this year.

Prof. Min Gu:Then finally, it must be related to the [inaudible 00:57:28] device. You have to follow the neural growth and then making sure that that will be the more sustainable approach, but this is a long way, probably another 50 years to go into that direction.

Xinghuo Yu:All right. Thank you very much. There's one or two more, then we ... I know I just remember you are standing between Min and the refreshment.

Speaker 5:I just have one question on this connection to computer science, machine learning, because on machine learning, you have this machine learning more like neural network, and you can do training. That means the connection waves can be adjust. If you can do this in, I don't know, in neuromorphic computing, is it possible to make them adjustable so that you can do them for this sort of learning or training?

Prof. Min Gu:Yes. Thank you. This is the way I found a few months ago when I was in Microsoft. Then I start see happening on the plane. There's 15 hours on the plane. Then you can start a speculation, think about all of these things.

Prof. Min Gu:This diagram, the dot is very important. This actually dynamically, we believe that very similar to the current memory disk, it's a photonic memory disk, so we can training this into the way to remember, and then do this machine learning thing. The learning function will be here.

Prof. Min Gu:I can talk to you which we collaborated, I want to show you in fact a very similar. This one, it means you can actually change status according to the output. We can achieve that loop, which is the learnings you need.

Xinghuo Yu:Thank you very much. Just the one last one. Anybody has ... ?

Speaker 5:Maybe I'll take the blame.

Xinghuo Yu:Oh, you'll take the blame.

Speaker 5:Sorry for holding you for the refreshment. Actually just a follow on Sheldon's question. In the recent years, in one of the bottleneck or one of the direction in AI or machine learning is the learning model is actually try to combine with memories.

Prof. Min Gu:Yes.

Speaker 5:I'm asking whether this structure can actually be a natural solution so that learn model also come with a memory.

Prof. Min Gu:Yes. The answer is yes, but there are two approach that currently in the future computer design. One is called in-memory computing. They follow the way the memory and the calculation combine together. This is the different approach. This come from the neuromorphic point of view, but they all achieve the same things.

Prof. Min Gu:In the end, these dots becomes the memory. On the chip, whatever happened, so this can remember, even you turn off the power, the state will be still remember, and then this becomes the memory which cannot do right now. Like we sleeping, we still have memory. This can be done. That's the way we want to achieve with the machine. This will be the on-chip memory simultaneously. These are the calculation.

Speaker 5:Yeah, but this is probably not exactly what I have in mind. When we talk about machine learning model has memory, they memorize variables before they're doing the decision?

Prof. Min Gu:Yeah. Our [inaudible 01:01:23] simply won't, but if you actually think about this array like the computer chip, and this can be proven.

Speaker 5:Ah.

Prof. Min Gu:I just simplify the ... I don't want to discuss all this. I have a much more complicated we have the calculation, and also each of the function can be train.

Xinghuo Yu:All right. You can continue discussion during the refreshment. Firstly, I would really like to thank Min for this very-

Prof. Min Gu:Endeavor.

Xinghuo Yu:... entertaining talk. I'm very enlightened, actually. Very nice on this Friday. I understand-

Prof. Min Gu:I saw the one mathematical formula.

Xinghuo Yu:I'm not sure, Min, I understood and all, but [inaudible 01:02:05]. Please join me to thank Min again for the excellent-

Prof. Min Gu:Well, thank you very much.

Xinghuo Yu:Thank you.