Feeling stuck, burnt out, or worried your role has an expiry date? In a world reshaped by AI, automation, and shifting job markets, the answer isn’t always starting over – it can be skilling smarter. Join a panel of career changers, industry leaders, and HR & L&D professionals as they unpack the skills employers are hiring for now, share real stories of successful mid-career pivots, and reveal how to stay relevant. Walk away with practical strategies to level up, open doors, and thrive, no matter your age or background.
:00:00:00 - 00:00:08:22
Speaker 1
So I guess. Firstly. Welcome, everybody. My name is Sarah Purches and I'm the talent strategy and experience manager at RMIT online. And I'm going to be your host today.
00:00:08:24 - 00:00:32:09
Speaker 1
I have spent 20 years in recruitment across in-house and agency. I've coached thousands of people on their personal brand in securing new roles as well as navigating career pivots. And thank you so much for taking your time to join me. Join us today. But it's going to be a really valuable conversation for everybody. But before we dive in, I'd really like to, kick off with an acknowledgment of country.
00:00:32:15 - 00:00:56:09
Speaker 1
I'd like to acknowledge the traditional owners of the lands where we meet and learn. I'm joining from the lands of the Wadawurrung People on the Bellarine Peninsula. And I also acknowledge the Wurundjeri and Boon Wurrung, peoples of the Kulin nations on whose lands that RMIT Melbourne's campuses stand. I'd like to pay my respects to elders, past and present, and to emerging leaders.
00:00:56:11 - 00:01:20:04
Speaker 1
And as we talk about career change and skilling smarter, I want to recognize that First Nations peoples have been learning, adapting and sharing knowledge on these lands for tens of thousands of years. Their knowledge systems show us that growth is collective, learning is lifelong, and leadership is grounded in community and care. So may we honor that wisdom today by coming together to learn, grow and share, to flourish.
00:01:20:06 - 00:01:42:22
Speaker 1
So we rarely taught how to interview well, how to write a strong resume, or even how to job search after school or university. So today is about closing that gap with practical, real world advice. No fluff. It's also fair to say that the market right now is quite possibly the most challenging market I have ever seen in my 20 year career.
00:01:42:24 - 00:02:07:09
Speaker 1
Roles are very competitive processes are somewhat slower, which baffles me with the technology that we have today. Rejections can be silent, which is actually really offensive, and confidence can really take a hit. So if you've been ghosted, knocked back, or stuck in that applyn and hope mode, you're not imagining it. And you're definitely not alone. Right now you might be feeling a little bit uninspired or unhappy at work, exploring the market.
00:02:07:09 - 00:02:29:18
Speaker 1
Or perhaps you're currently unemployed and hunting for that next role. So whether it's deepening a craft that you know really well or pivoting into something brand new today, you're in the right place. So I want you to kick back and think of the next 45 minutes as a reset with a clever, supportive friendship friendship group. You're going to get direct insights from a highly respected panel with serious street cred.
00:02:29:20 - 00:02:49:06
Speaker 1
We're going to cover what actually matters right now, and how to make the most of your strengths and so that they land where to upskill without dropping 50 K and a whole new degree. And hopefully you will leave with some clear next steps that you can actually act on right away. So please use the chat on the side for any of your questions or reflections as we go.
00:02:49:08 - 00:03:09:00
Speaker 1
Let's keep it quite practical so that you lead with clarity and confidence and make sure that you're listening and taking notes because you could win a prize. Share your takeaways from today on social, so LinkedIn, Instagram and the like. Make sure that you do tag RMIT online and you'll go into the draw to win a free RMIT Online Future Skills course.
00:03:09:02 - 00:03:29:00
Speaker 1
So, to our amazing panelists today, I would like to invite each of you to give us a quick pitch on who you are, what you do, and perhaps what your superpowers are. So firstly, I'm going to introduce you to Jelvie Gretch, who is a past student and future skills mentor. But, Jelvie I'm going to let you do your introduction.
00:03:29:00 - 00:03:31:08
Speaker 1
Tell us about you.
00:03:31:10 - 00:04:00:09
Speaker 2
Thankyou and thanks for having me in this panel. What a great introduction and really reflective, what we are going through today, in the market. So my background is in systems and data, particularly in human resource systems and, currently im the people systems and analytics manager for millennium services. And in addition to that, obviously mentor for RMIT online because I just really enjoyed my time, as a student of RMIT online.
00:04:00:09 - 00:04:12:06
Speaker 2
And I also wanted to give back, I guess, to the learning community in any way that I can. And I also teach at another university. So, really grateful to be part of this panel. Thank you.
00:04:12:08 - 00:04:16:19
Speaker 1
Thanks so much. Jelvie and Alyce O'Brien. Tell us about you.
00:04:16:20 - 00:04:18:09
Speaker 2
Who are you?
00:04:18:11 - 00:04:42:23
Speaker 3
Thanks, Sarah. I have been leading digital marketing and technology recruitment for businesses for the last 12 years. Agency side. So we work with everybody from start ups, scale ups, all the way up to enterprise. So I've got a good Intel today to share around the chaos that the market has presented to a lot of people. And I look forward to sharing those insights with you.
00:04:43:00 - 00:04:55:09
Speaker 1
And you are the director and founder of Level Up, which is so exciting Thank you for joining us today. Thank you. And we've got, Tanya Athens, who's head of OD at Hostplus A little intro from you please.
00:04:55:11 - 00:05:18:03
Speaker 2
Thanks, Sarah. So I've really focused my career around learning and organizational development, for well over 25 years. I hate saying that now, but, and and I think it's interesting. I, you know, I never started out with that intent when I graduated from university. So, you know, I think that's a story that will be common for many people.
00:05:18:05 - 00:05:59:17
Speaker 2
My focus around learning in OD and specialty has been, predominantly around, leadership and hypertential talent identification and working with organizations to really understand how do we, identify those people with potential and really build that skill and capability across the organization? So as an accredited organizational coach, I think one thing I bring is, a lot of experience in coaching, individuals and leaders in-house and having very much of, you know, these sorts of conversations with a lot of different people.
00:05:59:17 - 00:06:02:22
Speaker 2
So excited to talk about this topic.
00:06:02:24 - 00:06:21:11
Speaker 1
Brilliant. Thank you so much for joining us. So we'll jump into some of the questions. Let's start with the state of the market. And I'm going to throw it out to all panelists and jump on in. What do you think is one big change you've noticed in hiring or career progression? In the last, you know, let's say 2 to 3 years.
00:06:21:21 - 00:06:52:09
Speaker 2
I'll kick off from, from my perspective. And, and what's really coming up is, you know, everyone's, well, I'm assuming everyone's heard about portfolio careers, but essentially it's about, you know, this, this trend not to just focus on one, you know, either one profession, one income stream. And I think that's really picking up. And that's what I'm noticing as, as something in the last 2 or 3 years.
00:06:52:11 - 00:07:19:05
Speaker 2
Yeah. Probably. Sorry. Continue on that. Sorry Sarah. Just a good point. I'm probably a testament of what a portfolio career is, and I didn't even know I was doing that. But from around eight years ago, I, I figured out that there, there are way that I can transfer my skills into other industries and, I guess allow myself to experience, different ways that I can contribute to organizations.
00:07:19:05 - 00:07:39:02
Speaker 2
And then that apparently is now labeled portfolio career. So, yeah, it's good. It's good to see that. And I see that playing out in a lot of, other, I guess, colleagues of mine that I've studied with and I've worked with and they've realized they can actually tap into other sources of income and not rely on one employer.
00:07:39:04 - 00:07:42:18
Speaker 1
Yeah. That's a really that's a really big point right now as well.
00:07:43:10 - 00:08:03:05
Speaker 1
I guess which is some of the skills or capabilities, are you guys seeing kind of fading in demand and which are really becoming must haves? I know AI is a massive buzzword at the moment. But I'm also hearing organizations kind of shoot it down and being anti AI which I think is actually quite dangerous. And there's a lot of other kind of leading organizations that are embracing it.
00:08:03:05 - 00:08:12:05
Speaker 1
So, not to just, you know, focus on AI, but yeah. What are you seeing happening in the market in terms of skills and capabilities?
00:08:12:07 - 00:08:29:04
Speaker 3
Happy to jump in, Sarah. So there is a lot of discussion, a lot of, fear I guess, across the market for what AI adoption is. And I think that because of that I just wanted to quash some of the fears today. Yes.
00:08:29:04 - 00:08:36:11
Speaker 3
is moving way faster. And it actually is way more powerful in its impact than on society, than social media.
00:08:36:13 - 00:08:57:03
Speaker 3
But while you can use it to speed up content production, improve personalization, and reduce, you know, those manual tasks which I think most businesses are using it for currently, there is a lot of overuse in, content and SEO, but there's the hype around it. In reality, we are all thinking that we're not going as fast as we need to to keep up with it.
00:08:57:05 - 00:09:21:02
Speaker 3
But only 14% of Australian organizations have successfully scaled AI across their organization, and that was a report that just came out from Asana So I think there is this misconception that if we're not on touch of all the latest tools and technologies, we're being left behind. But in reality, businesses don't know how to actually set up those workflows and get those teams communicating with each other yet.
00:09:21:08 - 00:09:24:09
Speaker 3
So it is very much in that test and learn phase.
00:09:24:11 - 00:09:41:03
Speaker 1
Yeah, and I totally agree with that. And I think for particularly for job seekers out there, you know, when we do, I guess advertise for roles within RMIT online, you know, sometimes we're getting like 400 plus applicants in the space of five days, which is just I've not ever seen that before. And the quality is amazing.
00:09:41:03 - 00:10:04:10
Speaker 1
But one thing I do see is people, who are perhaps using an open AI, let's say ChatGPT, and they saying, hey, here's my resume and here's a job ad write a cover letter to make me look good. Now ChatGPT is essentially there to please you. You know, what it spits out may not necessarily be correct, but also it comes down to the art of prompting and really being clear on what you're trying to get it.
00:10:04:10 - 00:10:27:14
Speaker 1
I mean, I've had applications come through where people would say, you know, with my ten years experience and academic and, and whatnot. And then you look at the resume, and they have never been an academic in their life. It's purely just, you know, trying to please what the job ad is. So, I think, yeah, a lot of it comes down to just educating yourself a little bit more on how to use it, getting some basic prompting skills, understanding the limitations.
00:10:27:14 - 00:10:47:08
Speaker 1
But even from a business point of view is understanding the risks associated. You know, it's an open AI, so whatever you are putting in, you know, you don't want to put your job at risk by sharing confidential information. But yeah, I think there's a lot of room for education in that space. Still, like. Yes, it's here.
00:10:47:10 - 00:11:01:00
Speaker 1
Kind of like the internet and email and it's staying but you know, let's stay curious and let's continue to evolve our skillset in that space. I think it's a real compliment for everybody. No matter what industry you're in at the moment.
00:11:01:02 - 00:11:02:01
Speaker 3
Yes.
00:11:02:03 - 00:11:02:20
Speaker 2
Absolutely.
00:11:02:20 - 00:11:32:22
Speaker 3
Need to continue to, adopt. So they have to continually self train because most people that are completing university degrees or coming out of some form of study actually have a wider grasp on AI and what it can present for a business or a team and what the leadership does. Also HR teams, there's a whole gap in market right now with the knowledge that that needs to be taken on to be able to see these, workflows set up successfully across businesses to actually see it drive results.
00:11:33:02 - 00:11:55:19
Speaker 3
So where we do see, issues already would be ageism. That's already really heavy in the market, particularly for jobseekers. We do see a lot of discrimination because if you do use, a tool and you haven't really checked what that actually looks like in terms of what it actually has populated, you need to make sure that it's reflecting the honest truth of your experience.
00:11:55:21 - 00:12:20:06
Speaker 3
But Sarah, where I really see it being, positive for the job market is when you use it to actually enhance skills if you're looking to make a pivot or a change, particularly if you're looking to potentially move more into a different career, you can use it to actually help you write out what you need to make sure you're hitting the metrics of that job so it actually can be used positively.
00:12:20:11 - 00:12:39:03
Speaker 3
And I think there is a lot of benefit to it, but people are still scared to jump in and actually use it because every business or big businesses are still, you know, threatening with ATS systems that, you know, everyone's worried about what that looks like. If they do use ChatGPT as an example. Yeah. I don't think we need to have that, fear.
00:12:39:03 - 00:12:46:09
Speaker 3
Again, I think that you can use that if you use it. Right. And you do self-training or you do do a course, you will actually see that it can benefit you.
00:12:46:11 - 00:12:49:03
Speaker 1
Yeah. And Tanya you were about to say something just before.
00:12:49:07 - 00:13:11:03
Speaker 2
Yeah. I was concerned that you know picking up on that that famous fear people talk about it. But what are the what are the tasks that that are going to, you know, be picked up in and replace it? It it's the data entry, repetitive. You know, that sort of T1 query, you know, if I sit down with, with my teams and colleagues and peers and you say, what are that?
00:13:11:03 - 00:13:29:19
Speaker 2
What's the work that you don't like doing? It's that work. So it's it's just shifting the mindset and thinking, if I actually frame myself up, and, and we're able to use technology and or AI to, to do this, imagine what else I could be doing. So just a mindset shift can help.
00:13:30:00 - 00:13:49:01
Speaker 1
Yeah, absolutely. So from there, and this is probably something that a lot of people reach out to me on LinkedIn and ask, I would love to, and at Alyce this is probably a great one for you. But when you look at, resumes or LinkedIn profiles, what is catching your eye right now? You know what is probably some key advice you could share with our audience today?
00:13:49:03 - 00:14:08:10
Speaker 3
Yes, I think it's one of those things everybody needs help with the CV. So again, there's this fear or this perception that I don't have the best CV. Everybody needs advice. So first and foremost get that advice if you can, you know, speak to somebody in the industry or ask one of your friends or your colleagues or even your leader if you have a great relationship with them.
00:14:08:12 - 00:14:31:16
Speaker 3
And what you want to see is nowadays it's success that you've contributed to in a business or a role, versus just spurting out your role responsibilities. You really need to also have a strong profile summary around who Sarah is as an example. So if you can break down some of the success that you've driven or what you passionate about in your role, that really helps.
00:14:31:16 - 00:14:49:13
Speaker 3
And believe me, half of the market don't do that simple thing. I always recommend LinkedIn as well. You really need to use that as a tool. So whatever you're having on your CV, it seems pretty basic, but a lot of people miss this step too. You want to have the same opening summary or whatever it is that you summarize your abilities and your capabilities
00:14:49:13 - 00:15:00:10
Speaker 3
Are you want to have that on your LinkedIn summary as well? So even just those two things can make a huge difference to becoming attractive to a potential business.
00:15:00:12 - 00:15:26:00
Speaker 1
Yeah. That's a that's a really, that's a big thing. And that's something even I've noticed when I look at a resume, I often jump to someone's LinkedIn profile. Yes. And if there's disparity around dates of employment companies, if something's missing or it doesn't line up, you start to kind of question the integrity of the application. But I also know that when we've had roles like, you know, contractors and things like that, where we're like, I need someone now, we're not advertising or actually jumping on LinkedIn.
00:15:26:00 - 00:15:48:18
Speaker 1
So having that profile that really stands out, there is almost a mirror image of your resume, your work. What did you do? What were your achievements or what was the problem that you solved and how did you contribute? Having a clear headshot of yourself, which can be a selfie. Let's face that we don't all need to have to have a professional photographer, but I've been noticing some amazing LinkedIn profiles recently.
00:15:48:18 - 00:15:59:10
Speaker 1
It looks like it is something that's taken people a little bit of a while to catch up on. I think the resume may even be becoming redundant at some point, as we do, you know, lean on tools like.
00:15:59:10 - 00:16:28:03
Speaker 3
I would love that. I would. Unfortunately, businesses still want them. So yeah, digital first, LinkedIn first. Absolutely. That's a big part. And I say this to anybody, you have to have a presence on there, But you can't just have a profile and no connections and no activity. They want to see that you actually are active online, particularly if you're in marketing, digital, even technology content and creatives and marketers are judged the most harshly on how they summarize their skillset.
00:16:28:05 - 00:16:34:11
Speaker 3
So you really have to invest the time to make sure you are highlighting yourself correctly in this market.
00:16:34:13 - 00:16:55:14
Speaker 1
Yeah, great. Yeah I agree, let's jump into some of the real career change stories we said today earlier, we're not talking fluff here, but actually going to get into actual real life examples. Jelvie I'd really love to hear a little bit more about you. And what was the turning point that made you decide to change careers?
00:16:55:16 - 00:17:16:09
Speaker 2
For me, it was just, a curiosity to see what else can I do? I spent 16 years, my first 16 years, working at Linfox. And I was really blessed that, my leaders there saw a lot of potential in me that I hadn't seen in myself. And they really curated a lot of my professional development.
00:17:16:11 - 00:17:45:04
Speaker 2
But when I left, I realized that not all organizations and not all leaders are the same, and I can’t expect that from them. So I really took a charge in terms of where I wanted my career to go. And I actually explored different avenues, like I wanted to see how my skills would stand up in different contexts. I network with a lot of people, but for me, it was this pivot of being in the industry versus going into training and development, going into teaching.
00:17:45:06 - 00:18:21:00
Speaker 2
I realized, you know, I really enjoyed training people when I was working in projects. So how can I actually use those skills to further myself in those areas? So joining RMIT, for example, as a mentor really allowed me to continue learning. So that was a positive. It also allowed me to learn from the students. So the participants in how they're using these newly acquired skill sets that they've obtained, and that just gives me, I guess, an understanding of how, different industries actually use these skills and capabilities.
00:18:21:02 - 00:18:36:09
Speaker 1
Yeah. Great. And, Tanya, given your coaching expertise, what kind of mindset or narrative shifts do you nudge employees towards? When they feel like they're starting over and especially mid-career? I think that can be really a real challenge.
00:18:36:11 - 00:19:07:17
Speaker 2
Yeah. You know, reflecting about the coaching of mid-career people, I think the personal narrative is just so powerful is probably the one of the most powerful influences of success. And so practically, you know, where I've had focused is getting people to really watch their own language. What is the story they are telling themselves about themselves? What language do they use?
00:19:07:19 - 00:19:26:02
Speaker 2
When talking about their past and who they want to be in the future? So to make that practical for people, an example is like, you know, when you're describing you, this is what who are you and what do you do? And people say, I'm not I'm no good at that or that's that's not a real strength of mine
00:19:26:04 - 00:19:53:23
Speaker 2
Imagine the power if you actually just removed that from your from your language. So that's that's probably a starting point. That, that I work with mid-career professionals. Be conscious of the story that you're telling yourself. What's the language that you're using, and how could you shift that, to, to be more open and, and, you know, let's, let's, let's narrow in, in your own thinking about what you're capable of.
00:19:54:00 - 00:20:04:05
Speaker 1
Yeah. Great. And I guess to the panel, can you share an example of a successful career pivot that you've witnessed or even been partners ten years? Tanya i see you nodding
00:20:05:23 - 00:20:36:09
Speaker 2
you know, certainly one I've noticed a couple, you know, in my career, but, you know, always thinking, okay, what's, you know, what's something that stood out for me? I worked for leader a few years ago, and at the time, she was, leading, a transformation within an organization, you know, focused around, you know, a lean thinking, management system, continuous improvement.
00:20:36:11 - 00:21:04:10
Speaker 2
Designing the work from the perspective of the customer, and had an amazing skill set. Now, she started her career as a midwife. Oh, wow. And you might think, okay, how did that happen? But, you know, I, you know, I, I think it was it started by working in health care, and noticing, you know, what, what were her pain points?
00:21:04:10 - 00:21:30:19
Speaker 2
What what wasn't working? Well, and it probably started from seeing what what's the thing that frustrates me most and what might I be able to do about it? And it actually led to her in entirely changing, you know, working with health care, originally, but then broadening across multiple industries and, and is now sort of globally renowned, leader in, in lead thinking and continuous improvement.
00:21:30:21 - 00:21:57:12
Speaker 1
Yeah. No. That's great. That's great. I do recall we hired someone, who was actually referred to me many, many years ago at RMIT online who was a dentist, and I remember thinking, how where am i placing a dentist in RMIT online? And then we got chatting and just you look at those transferable skills like he's his customer service skills, the way he spoke to people so articulately and really listened and leaned in was just amazing.
00:21:57:12 - 00:22:17:12
Speaker 1
And yes, there a little bit of gaps in terms of technology, but I think one of the biggest things I've always seen is you can teach skills, right? You can't teach an attitude and you kind of reffered to before is, you know, what is the story you’re telling yourself. And I think your attitude and the way you present yourself out there is a is a really big thing that can potentially hold you back.
00:22:17:12 - 00:22:42:08
Speaker 1
And he went on to have an amazing career with us, with multiple promotions. And now, works at a very successful organization in a much more senior role. And, you know, he literally went from dentists to our student success team supporting our students and then transition forward. And it was just really beautiful to see But it was the persistence, the attitude and really looking at, okay, what am I really good at and what do I really love?
00:22:42:08 - 00:22:59:14
Speaker 1
And lean in start there. Like it's a good place to start, you know? What do I love? What am I good at. You know, what does that how does that translate in other organizations? I always remember that it was such a fond memory. And we still keep in touch, which is so lovely to see that career flourish. It's,
00:22:59:16 - 00:23:21:23
Speaker 1
Awesome. So perhaps we can get into this from starting over to leveling up. So, you know, how do we reframe experience and find transferable skills and strategies to, target upskilling that actually deliver so, I guess, you know, to the panel, how do you identify which of your current skills are transferable into a new industry?
00:23:21:23 - 00:23:50:10
Speaker 3
I'm happy to jump in Yeah. Everybody, this is something that I think this is something that a lot of people struggle with when we come from the society for many years ago, that there was a linear path in your career and, you know, you're supposed to just start and finish in the same place. But actually, what is so much more welcomed nowadays is what Sarah just shared in terms of your capabilities are very strong across a wide range of roles.
00:23:50:15 - 00:24:15:09
Speaker 3
And I think if we start to actually acknowledge that and welcome that in more opportunities in market, you'll see that. I mean, I had a marketer really senior marketer a couple of years ago, who decided she wanted to make a pivot into, project management. And so we worked with her on how her skills could be transferred, which, by the way, are very easily transferred into a PM role.
00:24:15:11 - 00:24:16:07
Speaker 3
I think that I'm.
00:24:16:07 - 00:24:19:12
Speaker 1
Sorry, just to stop you there Alyce Just for the audience, a PM role.
00:24:19:12 - 00:24:21:18
Speaker 3
Just for project management. Sorry, everybody.
00:24:21:21 - 00:24:23:13
Speaker 2
That's okay.
00:24:23:15 - 00:24:43:04
Speaker 3
So a project management role, within a business. So, you know, she was at a career level that many would be enviable of, you know, but I think ultimately you have to focus on where your strengths lie, what you enjoy most, because nobody wants to go into a role clock in, clock Out and, you know, not actually enjoy what you're doing.
00:24:43:06 - 00:25:15:02
Speaker 3
So for this person in particular, moving into a project management focused role, you know, we've worked on how to best summarize the skill set, which by the way, most of what you would do is quite transferable if you can communicate that in your resume or in conversation with people, and you have the ability to network. I know that's a real struggle for a lot of people, but if you can network yourself into some conversations, your leaders a great place to start, always sharing what you're looking to drive into but as a success story.
00:25:15:02 - 00:25:35:06
Speaker 3
For somebody stepping into a completely different, business unit, they're still working in project management now a couple of years later and thriving because they focused on what they love and how they could transfer everyday skills that they're already doing in their role into a very similar field, but a very different capability.
00:25:35:08 - 00:25:52:24
Speaker 1
Yeah. No. That's great. And I guess from the recruters side, we are getting a lot of questions and and we will have questions in a moment. So I'm going to address one of those. It's popped up. This will hopefully, help answer. But from a recruiter's side, like how important is demonstration of adaptability or learning agility versus traditional experience?
00:25:53:04 - 00:25:58:05
Speaker 1
And how can candidates best show that through their resumé or through an interview situation?
00:25:58:07 - 00:26:34:03
Speaker 3
Absolutely. I think this is the part that we always have to go back to. It is so important. Even if you have all of the skills, you've been doing a role for a very long time, where you're going to miss the beat is if you can't clearly articulate and show enthusiasm for what the role is that you're interviewing for as an example, or what you currently do in your remit, when somebody is visibly excited by a project they delivered or, you know, they're really proud of those achievements and they can communicate that that shines through in any conversation with anybody, whether it is just a networking thing.
00:26:34:03 - 00:26:56:10
Speaker 3
You've met somebody you know having that conversation, you'll be remembered because of the energy that you brought into that conversation. So I think all of that really plays the part. Communication gets you the role because if you can communicate clearly and you get excited by what the business does, or you get excited by the leader that you're going to work with or the team that you're going to step into, or it could be an industry change.
00:26:56:12 - 00:27:20:15
Speaker 3
All of those things are going to work in your favor. Versus somebody that has done the job for a particular long tenure . And I see it all the time. I see actually, people that have got ten years experience and getting pipped at the post by people with 4 to 5 years experience because they are bringing energy and excitement and they've got recommendations, or they go as far as looking up the website and saying, hey, here's some things that I've already noticed.
00:27:20:17 - 00:27:27:12
Speaker 3
Let's talk that through versus just expecting, because you've been doing the role for such a long time that you're going to be able to get that job.
00:27:27:14 - 00:27:44:00
Speaker 1
Yeah. Doing your own research is key. And I think you touched on something earlier. Networking. This is something that I see time and time again. And I think when you are looking for a new role, and particularly if you're looking for a career pivot, you've got to think like a marketer. Go to where your audience is.
00:27:44:00 - 00:28:14:06
Speaker 1
Right? So, you know, what are the networking events that you can find whether you're hunting through LinkedIn? There are a lot of different organizations that will host their own events. Whether it's webinars in person is potentially better for these situations. Meetup.com, you know, really getting yourself out there, get out and get out of your comfort zone and just start attending an even if those first few times you attend a purely sitting back and listening and observing and taking it all in, you'll eventually start building that confidence to start reaching out and building those conversations.
00:28:14:06 - 00:28:24:01
Speaker 1
But, you know, it can be a really great way to get, in front of people that perhaps, you know, are reading your resume and sending a rejection. Absolutely.
00:28:24:03 - 00:28:44:24
Speaker 3
I think I would even say that mostly people think that it's job sites or it's recruiters that will get you next job. I'm telling you now, it is your network that will present your next opportunity by far before any of us and any job site will and that's just the fact of how powerful and direct real life yes, you have to leave the comfy desk.
00:28:45:01 - 00:28:57:04
Speaker 3
Yes, you have to get out of your trackies and you have to go and actually speak to humans. But that is what's going to get you success far quicker and far greater than a job ad or a, job board.
00:28:57:06 - 00:29:12:20
Speaker 1
Absolutely. I got my last three jobs purely through networking, so yeah. Pretty exciting. And, Tanya, what would you say some of the critical elements that you look for in, you know, a skilling intervention that ensures long term impact and not just a flash in the pan?
00:29:13:00 - 00:29:58:16
Speaker 2
Yeah. So I you know, I can look at it this for a couple of, perspectives and, you know, one, if I look at just at the individual skilling level, what's going to really stick is being able to apply it quickly and to a real world situation. So, for example, you know, if there's anyone today that's saying, well, I want to build these skills, there's there's plenty of open source, content to actually focus and gain some formal skills, but it's how do I bring it back quickly and apply it and, and then regularly, review and reflect at an organizational level, I think about, large scale skilling interventions and and
00:29:58:16 - 00:30:41:03
Speaker 2
so that's what's going to be really sticky is managing it, with the, with a real focus on change management principles, you know, leadership from the top, really understanding the, the, the burning platform or like, what's, what's the wire between, doing, learning this, doing this and what, what outcome it's going to, to give us so and in that case, it's just, making sure that there is, you know, support from from peers, from leaders and, and the ability to, again, regularly repeat, test and learn, test and learn.
00:30:41:05 - 00:30:55:01
Speaker 2
So two, two different perspectives, one at the individual level, one from the organizational level, but they've got some of the same things in, in, what's going to stick is not doing something once and, and hoping for the best.
00:30:55:03 - 00:31:11:16
Speaker 1
Yeah. No that's that's great. And I think one thing you probably haven't quite touched on yet, you know, often we, we talk about finding that new job elsewhere, but sometimes your next role actually exists within your organization. So how do you feel employees can pitch themselves for new opportunities internally?
00:31:11:18 - 00:31:32:01
Speaker 2
Yeah. And, you know, there's a theme here for me. And I see it all the time, and I talk to people all the time in different organizations I've worked in. So there's a bit of a theme network, network, network. It is really just as we've talked about, you know, in the open job market internally do people know who you are.
00:31:32:03 - 00:31:54:08
Speaker 2
You know, seek people out for everyone wants a coffee or a tea, you know, offer, you know, and they'll give you 15 to 30 minutes of their time. When you seek someone out, ask questions, understand? But, you know, within a corporate environment, when, when people want to a thinking about their next role, you know, the decision makers need to know who you are.
00:31:54:08 - 00:32:11:22
Speaker 2
And so, like, if you get uncomfortable, put yourself out there. But, you know, when people know who you are, and that you've got energy. We've talked about that already. We've got energy and, and, real focus. I think there are a couple of things that are actually going to go a long way for you.
00:32:11:24 - 00:32:33:23
Speaker 1
Yeah. No, that's I agree with that. So throw it out to the wider panel. You know, how can if let's face it, it's it's really tough. There are a lot of people, people out there on out of work and have been flogging, you know, job applications like a dead horse. And it's frustrating. I really empathize, through going through that, you know, there's got to be that sense of burnout and complete defeat.
00:32:33:23 - 00:32:49:07
Speaker 1
So when you are going through that, all, you know, what advice would you give to someone to rebuild their confidence after redundancy, job loss, you know, essentially moving into that burnout phase. What advice would you give people facing that right now?
00:32:49:09 - 00:33:10:23
Speaker 2
I'll jump in. I think people need to be kind to themselves, you know, ive been through something similar. So a redundancy is something that can be taken personally, but understand that it's just the way for businesses to stay competitive. And sometimes that is that means removing roles even though you're performing really well at them. It's not really a reflection of your performance.
00:33:11:00 - 00:33:32:09
Speaker 2
I think for me, when I first saw my manager being made redundant, this is when I was in my early 20s and I saw that she had given 24 years to the organization. I promised myself that I would not be in a position where I felt lost, if that was to happen to me, because she went through that loss of identity, who am I now without my title?
00:33:32:09 - 00:34:02:19
Speaker 2
Who am I now without my employer? So I've made a commitment to actually just invest in my professional development because, I find that if you approach your career underpinned by continuous improvement, underpinned by lifelong learning, you're always at a at an advantage. So you're not actually a recipient, of an event or an occurrence that you're actually someone that can respond, in a better way to it.
00:34:02:21 - 00:34:25:01
Speaker 2
So my advice to people, sometimes you can get application fatigue. You can feel, like there's just nothing going your way to give yourself some time. Take a break. I think, Sarah, you mentioned that before we start thinking about what do I enjoy doing? What am I good at, and are there other avenues where I can actually contribute in that way?
00:34:25:01 - 00:34:40:11
Speaker 2
So I saw in the chat, some people have mentioned volunteering or even helping out in communities, because that will still allow you to practice those skill sets and you'll see immediate results, which gives you that sense of accomplishment.
00:34:40:13 - 00:34:43:03
Speaker 1
But also you never know who you're going to meet in those communities.
00:34:43:03 - 00:34:43:23
Speaker 2
Absolutely.
00:34:43:23 - 00:34:45:15
Speaker 1
they can open a door to a whole new role.
00:34:45:15 - 00:35:02:04
Speaker 2
Yeah. Yes, yes. And I find that people will mention your names in rooms that you haven't even entered because of what they've heard about you, because of what others have experienced through you. So just want to encourage everybody going through that, that there is a light at the end of the tunnel.
00:35:02:06 - 00:35:05:23
Speaker 1
Yeah. No, that's a really, really lovely answer. Is anyone else want to add to that?
00:35:06:03 - 00:35:28:10
Speaker 3
Yes. I think I just want to give people comfort too around the current market state. There are a lot of people over the last 3 to 4 years that have experienced redundancies. the top end of the market, hasn't had a lot of movement for a very, very long time. So what happens right now is the business expectations of what a role looks like versus the market expectations.
00:35:28:10 - 00:35:48:04
Speaker 3
So what I mean by that is the candidate and what they expect Renumeration to look like in terms of salary, whether it's flexible working, you know, nobody wants to be marched into an office five days a week. I don't even know why we're still having that conversation. But all of these things means that the businesses expectations are here and the candidates the here and then just not aligning.
00:35:48:04 - 00:36:07:22
Speaker 3
So that's why there isn't a huge amount of opportunity in market. It is a very unkind place to many, many, many people. And I really want to share that it mostly I get a call at least 3 to 4 times a week with a sad story about somebody that has actually lost their job or wasn't expecting it, and has been faced with unemployment.
00:36:07:22 - 00:36:29:04
Speaker 3
Their confidence is rocked severely. I'm talking about really strong people that I know personally, that call me in a really bad state because they feel like that they're never going to get another role or the market's just so bad and so all over the place with chaos that it's going to take them a really long time. And yes, that unfortunately, is the fact for many people.
00:36:29:06 - 00:36:52:00
Speaker 3
But again, if you do get yourself out of that frame, I know it's very hard, but you've got to remember who you are. You've also got to remember that you do have people that want to support you. So we tend to retreat and we tend to go in within ourselves. But ultimately, once you've had a couple of weeks to come to terms with the, you know, the way of the world and what's happening, you need to reach out to the people that you trust.
00:36:52:02 - 00:37:15:13
Speaker 3
You can, you know, you need to say, who can you introduce me to call recruiters call talent people call HR people call anybody in your market that you understand. You can have a good, honest, real, transparent conversation with because they are going to be able to help you. So I think it's that, taking the time to stop and just pause, take a moment, but then get yourself into some conversations and let other people step in to help you do that.
00:37:15:17 - 00:37:25:13
Speaker 3
We don't do that very often, but we need to do it more and it across every level. I'm talking everybody from juniors all the way up to your seniors. It is the common conversation.
00:37:25:15 - 00:37:37:01
Speaker 1
Yeah. And that's great thanks Alyce So I think we're going to start taking some questions from the audience. I have one here. If you had to start a new career tomorrow, where would you begin?
00:37:37:01 - 00:38:10:01
Speaker 2
I'd I would start with and it does sound cliche, but it it's true. But for many people I would start with what do I love doing honestly what what is the the the work or the activity that that lights me up? Really take some time to to explore that understand why it is and and and then once you really narrow that then you can start to broaden that thinking about the associated, potential careers that might be aligned to it.
00:38:10:01 - 00:38:33:17
Speaker 2
So, it is just one tactic, but quite useful. And then practically, I'd recommend for anyone who hasn't yet done any, spend a little bit of time around, utilize tools to understand what their strengths are. And, or, you know, what work styles and work preferences. There's there's quite a bit out of it out there that's free.
00:38:33:19 - 00:38:45:09
Speaker 2
But, you know, invest in some work styles, preference tools because it can give you an objective, you know, perspective and help you in that. In that process.
00:38:45:11 - 00:39:03:03
Speaker 1
It's almost like you need to reinvent yourself in a way. And one thing I always give to, to candidates about, you know, even LinkedIn. Right. You know, yes, get your resume reflecting the same. But think about your personal brand. Like when someone goes to your page, what is going to catch their eye? How do you tell a story that makes them want to read more?
00:39:03:09 - 00:39:23:12
Speaker 1
And it's not about spinning a load of rubbish. That's just not true. Everybody is unique and wonderful in their own way, and that's what makes us awesome, right? We don't want like for like for like for like that creates a very beige world. But I think, you know, try and change, do things a little bit differently, step out of your comfort zone, consider things you've never done before.
00:39:23:12 - 00:39:39:00
Speaker 1
And I mean, if you're currently not working. I said this to someone recently, like, what's stopping you from working at the coffee shop down the road for four months to bring in some income while you reset and figure it out? You don't know who's going to walk through that door and go, oh my God, you're a data analyst.
00:39:39:00 - 00:39:54:18
Speaker 1
We're hiring at my company right now like you should. I'd love to refer, you know, there's a lot of those kinds of opportunities, that I see coming up a lot, which I think is really exciting. What is one skill you tell everyone to develop this year?
00:39:54:20 - 00:39:55:15
Speaker 2
Is the.
00:39:55:17 - 00:39:58:24
Speaker 3
Network networking.
00:39:59:01 - 00:40:04:14
Speaker 1
I did notice a couple of people have asked, how do I network on LinkedIn? That's a that's a good one.
00:40:04:14 - 00:40:05:00
Speaker 3
Anyone want to.
00:40:05:00 - 00:40:06:06
Speaker 2
Yes to that.
00:40:06:08 - 00:40:29:08
Speaker 3
It's a common question I get asked a lot I think rejection I see a lot of people commenting about rejections on LinkedIn too, and then obviously people applying for roles over and over and getting 50 rejections. It's brutal. I know. I think the best recommendation for LinkedIn is to, again, lean on your network that's already existing. So who do I know that's connected to this person?
00:40:29:08 - 00:40:58:13
Speaker 3
Oh, amazing. Do you know this person? Would you mind giving me an introduction or allowing me to understand how I'd be best to reach out to somebody like that? That's first and foremost with the rejections. I think if you're continuously getting knocked back after knock back, you need to speak to either recruiter in the industry that you're applying for, or you need to speak to a leader or a past person that you've worked with and ask them for genuine feedback on your CV, because there is something that's not getting you success and traction.
00:40:58:19 - 00:41:09:06
Speaker 3
And it can be as easy as quickly making an update. And then you'll see a lot of, you know, easier conversation starting to flow, and you will receive a call or even at least a conversation to start.
00:41:09:08 - 00:41:26:14
Speaker 1
Yeah, yeah, I've seen one and I'm quickly going to answer it myself because I've done this. Someone was saying, and I can't remember who it was, but mentioning what if you're not CBD based and located in the country? I'm regional, I'm on the Bellarine Peninsula. I relocated here, just me and my baby from Saint Kilda, and I knew nobody here apart from my parents.
00:41:26:14 - 00:41:50:24
Speaker 1
And let's face it, they're not giving me a job any time soon. I couldn't find my community here, so I created it. There is in Melbourne, there's a Melbourne talent meet up. I know that there are other meet up groups in major cities specific to those industries, but I couldn't find it here. And so I started reaching out to all those people that, you know, like heads of HR and talent directors and whatever, in the region to ask them.
00:41:50:24 - 00:42:09:03
Speaker 1
And no one had heard of one. But they said, if you hear of one, let me know. And I kept hearing that. So I actually created and founded the Geelong talent meet up. So just because you can't find it doesn't mean you can't create it. And, you know, start behaving in ways and doing the work of what that job is.
00:42:09:03 - 00:42:34:20
Speaker 1
Someone mentioned before about trying to find UX work. Create yourself little portfolios. If you're not working and you see company out there with really bad UX, create something and pitch it to them. Like be bold, be daring. Like yes, they're like, why not? You've got nothing to lose. And the worst thing you're going to hear is no. So if you're already expecting no to be the answer and you're cool with that, and then you get a yes, like pump the air, how cool is that?
00:42:34:24 - 00:42:35:13
Speaker 3
Yes.
00:42:35:15 - 00:42:44:17
Speaker 1
We've got another question. Upskilling for older workers, please. Just some advice on where to start. We still want to be part of the evolution of various roles. Great question.
00:42:44:17 - 00:43:05:11
Speaker 3
I have happy to speak on this as well. That I think that any upskilling or short course that you can take for whatever it is that you're not feeling competent or confident in, in this new age of AI or digital or whatever it may look like is going to give you the success. Because mostly you don't walk away with all these new things to implement.
00:43:05:11 - 00:43:27:16
Speaker 3
You walk away with clarity around what it is that you thought was happening, and you lose the fear that I think we all have. Ageism is a problem in Australia. I talk to this a lot. I think that where you can try to, continue to build a platform is to use LinkedIn. So let's say the person that you mentioned before, Sarah, about a UX is how do I get into UX?
00:43:27:22 - 00:43:51:12
Speaker 3
If you're not currently working, use the projects that you studied in school, in either in university or a short course that you've done to highlight on your LinkedIn profile, and then connect with all the UX people that you can find on LinkedIn that are either leaders in that field or that have something to offer, and then start communicating stuff about UX so that you can build some profile and some brand awareness.
00:43:51:16 - 00:43:55:13
Speaker 3
People will start to notice you and then you'll be able to have more conversations.
00:43:55:15 - 00:44:14:16
Speaker 1
Yeah, yeah, I think that's really awesome. Another one. I'm curious what is most important now in terms of skills and experience? Someone with highly specialized skills, someone who has diverse skills, what I'd call a unicorn and experience. It's difficult to identify what is most important and where focus should go. Well, that's a good question.
00:44:14:18 - 00:44:32:14
Speaker 3
It's a great question. One that I get often, I think specialist roles, they were very heavy a couple of years ago. It was everyone wanted to be specializing. Now, with the age of AI and the disruption that is in the market, you'll hear over and over again from business leaders or people that are hiring in their teams.
00:44:32:18 - 00:44:54:10
Speaker 3
They want diversity. They want creativity. So they don't want somebody that's just done the one roll in their career. They want somebody I know it's sort of a two pronged thing. When you have if you move around a little bit, people often get a little bit hairy on, you know why have you moved. But in today's landscape of talent and the market, people are moving because of redundancies.
00:44:54:10 - 00:45:11:07
Speaker 3
Covid happened five years ago. There's still this misperception from leadership around people that have made a move. So I would say, you know, continue to shift if you like something, what you see another role that's maybe outside of your field. Don't be afraid to have those conversations to apply for them.
00:45:11:09 - 00:45:14:02
Speaker 1
What's your take on that, Tanya?
00:45:14:04 - 00:45:39:04
Speaker 2
I'd say it's the, the skill around developing agility and, adaptability itself is probably one of those things. It's going to help you be most successful. From a from an organizational perspective, one of the challenges that that we have is we know that in 3 to 5 years, the roles themselves are going to change.
00:45:39:05 - 00:46:10:06
Speaker 2
And often in businesses in different industries, we don't actually know what they will change to. We know they'll change. We don't know what they'll change to. So, the one thing that that hiring managers are doing is already saying, well, I, I want to look at someone who has that, general, skill building ability to adapt and change because, I know that well be in a better position than someone who's just, focused and narrowed.
00:46:10:09 - 00:46:16:14
Speaker 2
It's it's tough. It's it's hard to acknowledge, but it's unfortunate. So that's the reality of where we're at.
00:46:16:20 - 00:46:33:07
Speaker 1
Yeah. We are running out of time. I'm just I've just noticed one question that we haven't even covered. And I'm going to quickly answer it because something I'm so passionate about, recruiters also provide generic feedback and specifically say not to contact you after informing you that you've been unsuccessful. That makes my.
00:46:33:07 - 00:46:34:01
Speaker 2
Blood.
00:46:34:03 - 00:46:56:14
Speaker 1
Boil. If you are a recruiter or in talent acquisition, you should be doing your duty of care to make sure that you have collected specific feedback from everyone involved on your interview panel, and delivering that feedback with tan, tangible feedback to that person that had just spent time with you to interview. Show some damn respect and give it back.
00:46:56:14 - 00:47:16:16
Speaker 1
It is a tough market, and the only way we move forward into our next roles is by honest feedback. Clear is kind. Brené Brown has said it, so I want people to share that from the rooftops. If you don't get feedback, reach out to that person and say, I find it really odd that I'm not getting specific feedback after I've invested an hour.
00:47:16:21 - 00:47:24:02
Speaker 1
Could we take ten minutes just so I can get a little bit more detail? Don't be afraid to push back. Always push back.
00:47:24:04 - 00:47:25:08
Speaker 3
To oh man.
00:47:25:10 - 00:47:27:22
Speaker 1
I'm sorry. I could get on my high horse and shout about that all day.
00:47:28:01 - 00:47:50:05
Speaker 3
I’d like to add to that Sarah to me ask that you get a recruiter that hasn't given you the feedback around that recruiter directly message the person that you've interviewed with. You don't have to sit with that recruiter who's not giving you what you want, go direct to the person that you spoke with in an interview. Message them on LinkedIn or their email address and ask them, hey, I didn't get any feedback and I just wanted to understand from you the reasons why.
00:47:50:07 - 00:48:07:02
Speaker 1
Yeah, you deserve the feedback and you're entitled to it, and it demonstrates a lot about an organization. If they're not going to give you that. So do you want to work for that company? Food for thought. We're going to wrap it up there. Feel free to connect with us. It's a really tough job market. A lot of us do share stuff and insights online on LinkedIn.
00:48:07:06 - 00:48:30:11
Speaker 1
If it helps you, awesome. Don't forget the competition today. Share your thoughts today if there are any key takeaways. If you got some value from this please share it. You may never know who that might also help and inspire in your own community. And thank you to our amazing panelists today. It's been a pleasure. I think we could talk about this for hours, but we need a glass of wine to go with that its after midday
00:48:30:13 - 00:48:51:17
Speaker 1
Thank you to everybody who also took the time to spend with us today. Well done. You and I really hope that this has added some value to your lives that you can take away. I think our link is going to expire any second now, so I'm going to wave and say thank you and, hopefully well hear some great success stories where this is helped you get that next job.
Feeling stuck, burnt out, or worried your role has an expiry date? In a world reshaped by AI, automation, and shifting job markets, the answer isn’t always starting over – it can be skilling smarter.
Hear from this panel of career changers, industry leaders and HR & L&D professionals in this discussion on the skills employers are hiring for right now, real stories of successful mid-career pivots, and practical strategies to stay relevant and confident. Whether you’re looking to refresh your skillset, explore new opportunities, or simply build resilience in an evolving workforce, this session is designed to help you take action.
What you’ll take away:
The most in-demand skills today across tech, marketing, data, and leadership
Stories and insights from people who’ve successfully pivoted in their 30s and 40s
How to shift your mindset from “starting over” to “levelling up”
Practical ways to use short, targeted learning to stay competitive and open doors
As global expectations for corporate responsibility rise, businesses are under increasing pressure to demonstrate their commitment to sustainability.
With the rise of new and wildly popular image generators like Midjourney, Craiyon, and Nightcafe, not to mention platforms like Getty Images and Adobe launching their own tools, graphic designers are understandably feeling the pressure.
The world of work is constantly maturing - and so are the job roles. Professions, even industries, that didn’t exist a decade ago are quickly become highly sought after, leaving professionals scrambling to update their skillset.
In an increasingly digital world, cyber threats are evolving at an unprecedented pace.
RMIT University acknowledges the people of the Woi wurrung and Boon wurrung language groups of the eastern Kulin Nation on whose unceded lands we conduct the business of the University. RMIT University respectfully acknowledges their Ancestors and Elders, past and present. RMIT also acknowledges the Traditional Custodians and their Ancestors of the lands and waters across Australia where we conduct our business - Artwork 'Sentient' by Hollie Johnson, Gunaikurnai and Monero Ngarigo.
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RMIT University acknowledges the people of the Woi wurrung and Boon wurrung language groups of the eastern Kulin Nation on whose unceded lands we conduct the business of the University. RMIT University respectfully acknowledges their Ancestors and Elders, past and present. RMIT also acknowledges the Traditional Custodians and their Ancestors of the lands and waters across Australia where we conduct our business.
More information
